HALIFAX, TUESDAY, MARCH 26, 2024

 

COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE ON SUPPLY

 

3:45 P.M.

 

CHAIR

Danielle Barkhouse

 

 

THE CHAIR: Order. The Committee of the Whole on Supply will come to order. The honourable Government House Leader.

 

HON. KIM MASLAND: Chair, would you please call Resolution E4.

 

E4. Resolved that a sum not exceeding $1,579,169,000 be granted to the Lieutenant Governor to defray expenses in respect of the Department of Community Services, pursuant to the Estimate.

 

THE CHAIR: The honourable Minister of Community Services for his closing statements.

 

HON. BRENDAN MAGUIRE: I’ll be quick and short with my words, which is something that I struggle with sometimes. I will say that it’s great for me to see that there is a massive audience here tonight, not only on the floor but in the East Gallery, to see my closing statement. It feels good to know that my closing statement will be so impactful that it’s the show to watch tonight.

 

All jokes aside, I want to thank the Department of Community Services. While I’ve been there for a short period of time as minister, I have a lifetime of experience with that department. It’s a department that means the absolute world to me. It means the world to a lot of people.

 

I want to recognize that it is Social Work Month. I think I have said it before, but I truly believe that social workers are angels on earth, and I want to thank all social workers. My former social worker, Charmaine Tanner, is probably not watching, but if she is, thank you for everything you did over the years and the decades of help.

 

I do want to say to the staff that you do an incredible job. I want to apologize to the communications team. First and foremost, they wrote this beautiful 6,000-word opening statement for me, and I wrote about two words. Actually, I didn’t even do that. Someone once told me I had the ability to talk like Leo Glavine, and I think that is a compliment.

 

There are a lot of good things coming from this department. There is a lot of hard work coming from this department. One of the things I learned early on from sitting around that table and talking to individuals is that it is a department where you must find solutions. There are budgets and things like that, but it is also a department where they realize, they know, and they recognize the important work they are doing, and they put their hearts and souls into it.

 

One of the things is that they work insanely long hours. Unfortunately, I am the type of person who likes to text people at two o’clock in the morning - sometimes midnight, two o’clock, three o’clock in the morning. Sometimes I wake up at seven o’clock in the morning. I see some of the members - some of the individuals in the gallery who aren’t even in the department - nodding their heads, because they have experienced it. I do take my job seriously, and sometimes I know that I can go non-stop. It is only because I care for the people I represent, I care for Nova Scotians, and I firmly believe that we, as a society, will be judged by how we treat our most vulnerable. It is something I have always lived by, and it is something I have always believed in. I do see in this budget and in this department some incredible steps forward.

 

In Question Period, sometimes I say buckle up, and some people laugh and think it is a bit of a joke, but I mean that. There is more to come. We want to figure out how to break the poverty cycle, and that is something that is extremely important to me. We want to figure out how to give individuals choice and empower them. I do want to recognize, when it comes to helping people, poverty, income assistance, and choice, that I believe this is multiple departments, and we need to all work together. Multiple departments are working together on this: the Department of Health and Wellness; the Minister of Labour, Skills and Immigration and I are working on some things; the Minister of Seniors and Long-term Care, believe it or not, some things like you wouldn’t expect; obviously, the Department of Mental Health and Addictions; and the Department of Transportation and Infrastructure and the great work that is going on in the JRTA for transportation and getting people around. It is extremely important to get people around in an affordable, safe manner.

 

There is lots of great work that is going into this department. There are a lot of people to thank, from the deputy on down. One of the first things we talked about in the department is how we engage and how we speak to the employees. We will be holding lots of topic-based meetings with our frontline workers, whether they are child protection workers, social workers, or other people who work for that department, I want them to know their voices will continue to be heard and they will be heard in a strong manner.

 

When we have these conversations, I am going to look forward to the ideas that are coming from them. I want them to bring their ideas, bring their stories, and tell us what we can do - what I can do as the minister - to help this department evolve, continue to grow, be the best they can be. I think that starts with from the top - listening and leadership from the top.

 

The other thing we will be doing is an administerial round table, where we are looking at engaging our stakeholders, whether it is ones who deal with youth in care or income assistance. There are all kinds of different things we are dealing with from a department standpoint. We want to hear from those stakeholders to see and hear what they’re going through, and the solutions.

 

I don’t believe one person has all the answers. I believe that we have a wealth of experience, be it from the clients that we serve, the individuals who serve those clients, or the stakeholders. We are going to be engaging our clients. We are going to be engaging our stakeholders and our workers to ensure that their voices are heard in the decisions that we make.

 

I want to thank the department. I know that this can be a thankless job. I know it can be a job that you take home. When you deal with an issue, sometimes it doesn’t go away. I am going to wrap up in a few minutes. I’m not going to go much longer, but I wanted to say I know from my own personal experience when dealing with some of these very, very deeply personal issues that we deal with as MLAs and in our constituency offices.

 

I still think of 2013, shortly after I was elected, when there was a young child who came into my office. He was the same age as my son. He had a rare skin disease where he had to constantly be wrapped. Any type of contact with his skin would cause abrasions. His parents were young parents, and they came into my office and brought him in. It just so happened that day that I had my son with me. I watched them play and it really hit me hard why I was doing this and what I was doing it for.

 

They were struggling. One of the parents always had to stay home to help their son, and they were struggling. We were able to work with them to help that young boy have - and these are their words - a better life. I still talk to those parents. I still hear from those parents. One of the things that I think is rewarding is we’re able to do that and follow up and see the successes. I think that is the definition of what a public servant should be, whether it’s an MLA, an elected official, someone in the Department of Community Services or any department.

 

These stories are deeply personal and they’re ones that don’t go away, so I want to thank the staff. I know there were lots of sleepless nights. They did an incredible job, and they are doing an incredible job with homelessness and dealing with some of the issues we’re facing today.

 

Someone in the department mentioned to me today that two and a half years ago they were essentially spending just over a million dollars on homelessness, and today that’s at least twentyfold, if not way more. I don’t have the specific numbers, so I’m not going to quote it, but it just shows how quickly things change and how this department is able to ramp up and deal with the issues that are facing Nova Scotians.

 

A deep-rooted thank you. Aside from being a father and a husband, this will be quite possibly the greatest honour of my life. I’m going to do everything I can. Someone who is highly partisan said to me the other day that there are massive expectations on me, and I was going to fall under those expectations. We got into an exchange of words, and I won’t repeat everything that was said, but what I ended up saying to the person is that it doesn’t matter what expectations you put on me or any of these parties put on me: My expectations are higher and I’m going to do everything I can to achieve those.

 

As I’ve done my whole life, if I’m going down, I’m going down swinging. I will do everything possible to help this department. I will do everything possible to help the people who need it the most, and I will do everything possible to make the people who elected me proud. Let the chips fall where they may. I’m very proud of this opportunity and that the Premier saw in me that I could do this. It means a lot. I’m going to continue to prove people right, that I’m the person for this job and that I will put the partisanship aside when it comes to our most vulnerable and do what is needed.

 

With that, Speaker, lots of love to the department and the people who work every single day.

 

Resolution E4 - Resolved that a sum not exceeding $1,579,169,000 be granted to the Lieutenant Governor to defray expenses in respect of the Department of Community Services, pursuant to the Estimate.

 

THE CHAIR: Shall the resolution stand?

 

The resolution stands.

 

The honourable Deputy Government House Leader.

 

JOHN WHITE: Would you please call the Estimates for the Department of Public Works, Resolution E36.

 

Resolution E36 - Resolved that a sum not exceeding $716,170,000 be granted to the Lieutenant Governor to defray expenses in respect of the Department of Public Works, pursuant to the Estimate.

 

THE CHAIR: I will now invite the Minister of Public Works to make her opening comments if she wishes, and to introduce her staff to the members of the committee.

 

The honourable Minister of Public Works.

 

HON. KIM MASLAND: Thank you for the opportunity to talk about the work we do for Nova Scotians at the Department of Public Works. It is a privilege to serve as the member of the Legislature for Queens, Minister of the Department of Public Works, and as Government House Leader.

 

Serving in these roles has given me the change to work with many extremely talented and dedicated people; people who put their heads down and work in all conditions for Nova Scotians. I have also been able to be part of many projects that will have lasting effects on the lives of Nova Scotians for generations to come.

 

Next to me today I have two people from the Department of Public Works whom I am fortunate enough to work with. Peter Hackett, the Deputy Minister: I cannot imagine doing this job without having Deputy Minister Hackett along my side. I have such tremendous respect and admiration for the time he has put in with the department, his knowledge and his support for me. We certainly have become a team. Brent Pero, Executive Director, Financial Advisory and Services: This guy right here thinks that Estimates is like the Super Bowl, so he gets a little more excited than I do but certainly I try to share his enthusiasm.

 

In the gallery there are more folks from the Department of Public Works, Build Nova Scotia, and the Joint Regional Transportation Agency. I actually get a little emotional when I think about the fact that I have the opportunity and the privilege to work with these people every day. You sacrifice so much in these jobs when you become a minister and certainly my family has sacrificed a lot and so have I. Through all of this I have gained this amazing family up here and I just want to thank all of you for allowing me the opportunity to learn from you, to be present with you every day, for your support. I will never forget you as long as I live, never.

 

The Department of Public Works has many important jobs. We are probably best known for building and maintaining provincial highways, roads, and bridges. We also build and maintain government buildings, courthouses and museums, and operate seven ferries in our province. Our Crown corporations include Build Nova Scotia, the Joint Regional Transportation Agency, Halifax Harbour Bridges, and the Highway 104 Western Alignment Corporation; plus we are involved in active and community transportation, dams, aboiteaux, road safety, the vehicle registry, and much more. It’s a big and exciting role that is full of opportunities and challenges.

 

Before I get too far into updating you on the great work we are doing at the Department of Public Works, I’d like to talk about the unprecedented weather events we experienced. I don’t think any of us were prepared for what we saw over the last year. These major weather events created challenging and stressful times for Nova Scotians. We watched our neighbours lose houses, belongings, and loved ones. It was heartbreaking, but Nova Scotians are strong and determined people. Like always, we lent a hand to our neighbours and picked ourselves back up.

 

[4:00 p.m.]

 

During the Summer’s historic rainfalls and flooding, a large number of provincial roads, highways, and bridges were damaged and required urgent repairs. Almost $70 million worth of damage was done. Without hesitation, the road-building industry was there to help fix damaged infrastructure and make sure the public could get where they needed to safely.

 

With an already packed work schedule and major roadwork going on in all parts of the province, repairing what needed to be fixed was another task for an already very busy industry, but they made it happen. They reassigned resources and they prioritized their work. They made sure that Nova Scotians had safe roads, bridges, and highways to travel on once again.

 

They then had to go back to their previous projects and play catch-up. This was no easy task, and I know how much work it took. I’d like to thank the road-building industry for taking on this challenge and being there for Nova Scotians when they needed them the most.

 

Then came the snow. We set a record in February for the most snowfall that month that the province has ever seen. The amount of snow that fell in February was a challenge for our department, but we know how important it is for people to be able to travel safely. We rolled up our sleeves and worked around the clock for weeks to get the job done. It was tens of thousands of hours of non-stop work by our crews, private contractors, the federal government, municipalities, and our neighbours in P.E.I. and New Brunswick. Truly a massive effort, and we are grateful for all the support that we received.

 

Our government released Budget 2024-25 on Thursday, February 29^th. It reaffirms our commitment to moving our province forward and builds on the important work that we have already started. Budget 2024-25: Building Nova Scotia Faster sees more support for health care transformation. We said from the beginning that we would fix health care, and we’re well on our way.

 

This budget also invests in the services people need to build a skilled workforce, more housing, and a stronger, cleaner economy. Our province is growing rapidly, and we know that we need to make sure that the supports and services people need are there for them today and in the future. Nova Scotians are feeling the pressure of higher costs of living, and we are listening and helping to improve the quality of life for all Nova Scotians.

 

As a government, we can see the potential that our province has. Our job is to help us reach it. More, Faster: The Action for Health Build is a comprehensive plan to get Nova Scotians better health care services more quickly, and we’re well on our way to doing just that. My colleague, the Minister of Health and Wellness, is leading the charge on our work on More, Faster. She is overseeing modern, high-quality health care infrastructure projects that will give all Nova Scotians what they need and deserve.

 

These projects will improve access to services and supports and help retain and recruit health care professionals. We have several health care infrastructure projects on the go across our province. From building new, innovative health care facilities to renovating existing spaces to better serve Nova Scotians, we are hard at work improving health care in our province.

 

Some of the highlights under the Minister of Health and Wellness’s portfolio are completing the Bayers Lake Community Outpatient Centre, which is now improving patient care, breaking ground on the Halifax Infirmary replacement this Spring, continuing progress on all aspects of the CBRM redevelopment, and the creation of the new Transitional Care Centre facility in West Bedford.

 

I also have several health care infrastructure projects within my portfolio. I am pleased to say that these projects are moving forward and we are making good progress.

 

The Yarmouth emergency department project has completed the early works package, schematic design, and draft of a developmental design report. In mid-February, we announced that we’re moving into the construction phase of the new department. The new emergency department includes doubling the size of the emergency department and upgrading the emergency power supply for the entire facility. Currently, the facility can care for 14 people at a time and handle only two ambulances. The expanded emergency department will be able to care for 30 people and handle four ambulances.

 

The North Cumberland Memorial Hospital is nearing completion and will open this Spring. This new health care centre will provide emergency services and clinical spaces, including a collaborative clinic, administrative spaces, short stay observations, rehab services, blood collection, and ancillary places. The helipad construction is ongoing and is anticipated to be completed this Spring. Demolition of the existing hospital facility will be tendered and executed to align with the operation of the new facility this Spring.

 

The South Shore Regional Hospital is moving along very well. We have approved $130 million for this project. The first phase, which includes an expanded emergency department, endoscopic and dialysis unit, and MRI, is scheduled to be completed in early 2026. Phase 2 is scheduled to open in the Fall of 2027. It will include day surgery, and there are two portions of the work that are still to be assigned.

 

The IWK emergency department redevelopment is well into construction. Demolition is complete, and concrete placement and structural steel installation is ongoing for the new building. $127 million has been approved for this project, which includes three triage rooms, 24 examination rooms, two trauma and resuscitation rooms, four mental health and addiction care rooms, a mental health day room, a low-acuity treatment space, a CT scanner in close proximity, and a double ambulance bay. Construction began on the new IWK emergency department in 2022 and is expected to be finished in 2026. This is an extremely exciting project for our province.

 

The $7.2 million renovation of the existing space to construct the new Dartmouth General Hospital MRI suite is expected to open this Spring. We are also making progress on the Cumberland Regional Health Care Centre. This project includes an emergency department and a 12-station renal dialysis unit. The early works package is complete, and we have awarded the collaborative design team contract.

 

Our government is committed to fixing health care. A big part of that is updating a building, new infrastructure to allow providers to give better service, and to help accommodate our continuously growing population. But that is only a small portion of the work that we do at the Department of Public Works. We are about making sure communities have the infrastructure they need to thrive, and a big part of that is making sure they’re connected by efficient, safe roads and highways.

 

We are about helping to make sure Nova Scotians can travel to school, to work, and to get home at the end of the day to see their families. We are about making it possible for us and visitors to travel from one end of the province to the other, exploring the beauty that Nova Scotia has to offer. We’re about making sure grandparents can drive to see the smiles of their grandchildren. Quality safe roads are something many of us take for granted, but none of the things I’ve mentioned would be possible without them.

 

It’s thanks to the more than 2,000 hard-working staff at the Department of Public Works that much of that is possible. I am so pleased that since becoming minister I’ve been able to get out to meet, on the road, many of the hard-working, dedicated Department of Public Works field crews right across our province. In Nova Scotia, we have 23,000 kilometres of provincially owned roads and highways. There are also 4,100 provincially owned bridges across our province. Maintaining that many kilometres of road and bridges is no easy task. It takes an army. It takes working collaboratively with our private sector and our government partners and stakeholders to address Nova Scotians’ transportation and infrastructure needs. To do this, the Department of Public Works has employees stationed throughout the province.

 

We have four districts - Western, Northern, Central, and Eastern. Within these districts, there are multiple bases and depots where staff are stationed. These employees play a massive role in maintaining our roads and keeping them safe. From road maintenance to snow removal, these folks do it all. I would like to take some time to thank them for their hard work by highlighting some of the programs and activities that they deliver.

 

This past year has been unprecedented for Nova Scotia. With the most devastating wildfires to the wettest Summer for much of the province and if that wasn’t enough, the province has seen enormous amounts of snow so far this Winter season. As part of our responsibility to provide safe, quality roads and highways for Nova Scotians, we need to make sure we can respond to increasingly frequent weather events. Our goal is always to get our roads, highways, bridges, and other critical infrastructure open as fast as possible. To do this requires preparation. We always prepare when we know a storm is coming so we can act quickly to repair the damage. This includes stockpiling resources and making sure our people and equipment are ready and in position.

 

Another key component of preparing to respond to a severe weather event is coordination. The Department of Public Works has formed a Storm Preparedness Committee that meets before forecasted major weather events; a first of its kind in the department. The committee includes partners from the Nova Scotia Emergency Management Office, Nova Scotia Power, and the Department of Labour, Skills and Immigration. The committee helps create a cohesive and proactive approach to preparing for the increased storm activity we are experiencing here in our province.

 

Through the Storm Preparedness Committee, we have opened communication lines with various stakeholders. This ensures that all are in alignment on how to prepare to coordinate efforts more effectively during a storm and as minister, I am extremely proud of this collaboration.

 

With these increasingly frequent severe weather events, we need to ensure that new infrastructure that is built is more resilient. That has changed the way we build and that we repair our infrastructure. Through our capital plan we have been steadily upgrading and improving infrastructure to be more resilient across the province.

 

The department considers climate change and adaptation when planning and designing bridges, highway upgrading, and new construction projects. All new projects are designed and constructed with climate change readiness in mind. When we make repairs to infrastructure that is damaged by storms, we make sure that they will be able to stand up to the weather.

 

Another key to success in responding to storms and damaged infrastructure is making sure we have the supplies on hand to make the repairs. We are working hard to ensure we have spare culverts, pre-built temporary bridges on hand to react to severe storms and storm surges when they impact our existing infrastructure. We are also working to raise critical roads and bridges and areas vulnerable to flooding.

 

Nova Scotia has more than 8,400 kilometres of gravel roads. These roads make up 35 per cent of our road network. Keeping these roads in good, safe condition is essential for those living in rural communities. We know just how important it is, which is why we have consistently increased funding to improve gravel roads across the province. Since forming government in 2021, we have added an additional $100 million into the Gravel Road Capital Program. This funding is used to improve existing gravel roads in rural communities across the province. It allows us to proactively rebuild roads to improve the structure and drainage, which results in longer-lasting roads, improves safety, and reduces maintenance costs down the road.

 

[4:15 p.m.]

 

Department staff evaluate and prioritize the gravel roads that need the work the most. The criteria they use to evaluate roads include traffic volumes, pot holes, loss of gravel, ditches, culverts, overgrown brush, and drainage pipes. A full list of gravel road projects can be found in our Five Year Highway Improvement Plan, which I’m sure all of you use as your bedtime reading.

 

Last year, we increased our budget for the Rural Impact Mitigation Program. Again, we know how important our road systems in our rural communities are, and that’s why we once again added an additional $14 million to the program for a total of $36 million. This program supports road maintenance, improvements including pavement and gravel-patching, brush-cutting, ditching, culvert replacement, guard rail replacement, and shoreline protection. These two programs are important to keeping our provincial road network maintained. They help connect our rural communities and keep drivers safe.

 

Over the last few years, we have seen more than our fair share of tropical storms and hurricanes. Climate change is something we are all concerned about, and something that we take very seriously. We have heard concerns about the Chignecto Isthmus as sea levels rise. We’ve heard those concerns, and we share them. The Chignecto Isthmus is a critical land transport corridor for the people and goods travelling between Nova Scotia, Prince Edward Island, Newfoundland and Labrador, and the rest of Canada. It also has the only railway between Nova Scotia and New Brunswick.

 

It is estimated that $100 million worth of goods pass through the isthmus every single day. A network of dikes and aboiteaux were built in the isthmus in the late 1600s. They currently protect communities, infrastructure, private lands, and natural resources from rising sea levels. With sea levels continuing to rise and more frequent storms, there is a threat to corridor and the communities the dikes protect. The Government of New Brunswick and the Government of Nova Scotia are collaborating to undertake planning work for a dykeland system infrastructure solution for the Chignecto Isthmus.

 

The proposed project will complement and improve the existing dykeland system infrastructure along the Chignecto Isthmus to protect important assets from the impacts of sea level rise and storm surge in the Bay of Fundy. To complete this project, and to continue to protect surrounding communities and the trade corridor, it is estimated to cost $650 million and take about 10 years to complete. The federal government has a responsibility to protect national trade corridors. Nova Scotia and New Brunswick believe the federal government is responsible for paying for this important project, and we’ve made our position very clear. We also know that this is a project that can’t wait. We are acting now, and we are preparing to get this job done over the next 10 years while we work to get the federal government to live up to its responsibilities.

 

During my time as Minister of Public Works, we eliminated the tolls on the Cobequid Pass for Nova Scotia-registered vehicles. Staff in my department worked hard to make sure roughly 60,000 Nova Scotians received refunds for their pre-paid accounts. The department’s work to construct two new rest areas with parking and basic facilities continues. We have also introduced legislation under the Financial Measures Act that will allow us to use any extra revenue made from out-of-province vehicles for maintenance on any of our 100-series highways.

 

We have a lot going on at the Department of Public Works. We are a big department with many projects on the go at any given point. Our overall operating budget for 2024-25 is $716 million. The operating portion of our budget is used for the day-to-day operations of the department such as snow and ice control, highway and bridge maintenance, field operations, fleet amortization, ferry operations, vehicle compliance, engineering and construction services, administration, professional services, employee benefits, road improvement, maintenance work, and smaller highway and building projects.

 

In December, we released our 2024-25 Five Year Highway Improvement Plan. The plan outlines government’s approach to building, repairing, and maintaining the province’s 23,000 kilometres of roads and highways and its 4,100 bridges over the next five years. It includes major highway and road projects, repaving, major bridge replacements, capital maintenance, and infrastructure work. Sharing the specific plans early for road improvement in the Five Year Highway Improvement Plan gives the province’s road-building sector a better opportunity to prepare.

 

This year we expect to work on more than 160 highway improvement projects, and we need them ready. Sharing the plan early also keeps Nova Scotians informed about the important road and bridge improvements being made in their communities.

 

This year I’m pleased to say we are continuing to make significant investments in our province’s transportation infrastructure with around $500 million being invested in roadwork and major projects. Our investments made through this year’s plan will improve more roads and highways across our province. It will make them safer, with increased investment in gravel road upgrades and rehabilitating paved roads. We are increasing our investment in these important areas by continuing to add about $75 million to our budget.

 

All our major projects will continue again this coming construction season. Planning and preliminary design work has started on six new major projects that were announced last year. These projects include Highway No. 103 Argyle interchange, Exit 32 and Exit 32A; twinning Highway No. 103 from Exit 6 to Exit 7; twinning Highway No. 103 from Exit 7 to Exit 8; twinning Highway No. 104 from Taylors Road to Paqtnkek; twinning Highway No. 107 from Burnside to west of Loon Lake; and Highway No. 101 Cambridge interchange and connector.

 

Construction will continue on five major projects this coming year. They include Highway No. 101 from Three Mile Plains to Falmouth; the Highway No. 102 Aerotech connector; Highway No. 103 from Tantallon to Hubbards; the Bridgewater interchange; and the Highway No. 107 Sackville-Bedford-Burnside connector.

 

Work on infrastructure upgrades for the Tancook ferry will also begin this year, which involves upgrading the wharf and road required to support the new car ferry. The Five Year Highway Improvement Plan also includes access improvements for the province’s 100-series highways that are not being twinned. This work includes improving intersections and adding passing lanes, turning lanes, and roundabouts. Our roads, highways, and bridges create a road network that connects us from one community to the next and creates safe and efficient trade routes.

 

The work we do to maintain and improve these routes will help Nova Scotians and visitors be safe when they’re travelling on our roads. It will also make sure that we have high-quality transportation infrastructure that allows businesses to move their products around the province and North America, helping foster a strong economy.

 

This work has a major impact on all Nova Scotians. We couldn’t do it without the road-building industry. They ensure we have safe, quality, and efficient roads to travel on. They help us recover from unprecedented weather events that damage roads and bridges and they play a significant role in our economy by providing good jobs for Nova Scotians, employing more than 7,500 people directly each year.

 

As I mentioned, we have 4,100 bridges provincially owned and maintained in Nova Scotia. They are another critical part of our provincial transportation network. They play an important role in connecting our communities, and many Nova Scotians rely on them. Bridges, like all other infrastructure, require maintenance and they have a lifespan.

 

Knowing how important bridges are and the need for maintenance and repairs, we doubled the funding for our bridge rehabilitation program two years ago. We are continuing this $60 million investment to repair and replace existing structures for Nova Scotians. This will allow a proactive approach to expand the rehabilitation and replacement of existing structures, which will improve safety and reduce maintenance costs in the long run.

 

Nova Scotia’s 100-series highways are critical to our transportation system. They connect communities from one end of the province to the other and they play a key role in business, tourism, and our everyday travel.

 

At the Department of Public Works, safety is always a priority. Twinning our major highways increases safety on our highways, as well as helps improve efficiency for commercial and recreational travel. That is why we continue our commitment to ongoing twinning projects, including Highways No. 101, 103, 104, 107, and the Sackville-Bedford-Burnside connector. That’s a mouthful. Here’s quick update on some of these projects.

 

Highway No. 101: The 9.5-kilometre Highway No. 101 twinning project through the Windsor area from Three Mile Plains at Exit No. 5 to west of Falmouth Exit No. 7 is well under way. The reconstruction of the Exit No. 7 interchange is now complete, and traffic is fully divided throughout the project limits. Work continues on the reconstruction of the Exit No. 6 interchange and is scheduled to be completed this year.

 

Due to the complexity of the aboiteau project on the Windsor causeway, the environmental approval process has taken much longer than we anticipated. We have responded to a request from The Department of Fisheries and Oceans for additional information on how the proposed structure can best accommodate fish passage, and we’re awaiting their response. Pending regulatory approvals and no major changes to the detailed design, the department expects to be construction-ready this year. The structure will take two to three years to construct.

 

Highway No. 102 Aerotech connector: Work is continuing on this connector project. The project includes a new connector road between Trunk No. 2 and Highway No. 102 at Exit No. 5a, roundabouts, and two other structures. This project is anticipated to vastly improve traffic flow and reduce congestion on the growing Fall River-Waverley area. Subgrade work is expected to be completed this Summer. The paving tender will be issued soon, and the project is expected to be completed by the Fall of 2024.

 

The Highway No. 103 project is going to make a significant difference in the area by improving safety and efficiency along the South Shore. Construction to build the new 22-kilometre, four-lane divided highway between Exit No. 5 at Upper Tantallon and Exit No. 6 at Hubbards is nearly complete. The final small section of twinning for this project is expected to be completed and opened to traffic in early 2024. I see, Chair, that you’re sharing in my enthusiasm at that project being completed. I know we both travel that road.

We’ll then get started on the next section of twinning: Exit No. 6 at Hubbards to Exit No. 7 at East River. This project will see around 9.5 kilometres of highway twinned, and the reconfiguration of Exit No. 7. Work will start this year with clearing and bridge construction.

 

Highway No. 104: This was an exciting year for the Antigonish area. After many years of conversations and three years of construction, the Highway No. 104 twinning project from Sutherlands River to Antigonish opened to travellers. This project includes 28 kilometres of new two-lane twinned highway, and 10 kilometres of new four-lane twinned highway. There are two new interchanges and about 24 new bridges. This project was built through a P3 partnership with Dexter Nova Alliance, who will operate and maintain the highway for the next 20 years following.

 

Highway No. 107, the Sackville-Bedford-Burnside connector: This project will see a four-lane highway that will more directly connect Burnside Park to the communities of Bedford and Sackville. It will result in improved safety, reduced travel times, and more efficient movement of people and goods through the Halifax Regional Municipality and the provincial highway system.

 

This project, along with many others, faced challenges this year, especially with the extremely rainy Summer. This project has also faced challenges such as the relocation of ash trees, which are of cultural significance to the Mi’kmaw people. We are making progress and the project is scheduled to be completed by the end of Summer.

 

In our Five Year Highway Improvement Plan, we have several highway projects that we plan to begin within the next five years. They include Highway No. 103 Argyle interchange. Exits No. 32 and 32a on Highway No. 103 have raised safety concerns for many in the area. The two exits are at an at-grade intersection with the No. 103 and a very busy section of the highway. There is also a major driveway off the highway that connects to a long-term care seniors home. This project will improve safety in the area and will include a new diamond interchange at Trunk 3. The reconnection of Trunk 3 through the project area will also be completed, reinstating the section of the secondary road which was lost when Highway No. 103 was originally constructed. This project is expected to begin next year.

 

Highway No. 103 twinning Exit 7 East River to Exit 8 Chester: As I mentioned, this work will begin this year. The next section of this highway to be twinned is Exit 7 at East River to Exit 8 at Chester. This project, along with other twinning projects, has traffic volumes that exceed 10,000 vehicles per day, which is a metric we use to support the need for a twinned highway. The work from Exit 7 to Exit 8 will result in construction of approximately seven kilometres of new twinning and the replacement of the Exit 8 interchange structure.

[4:30 p.m.]

 

Highway No. 107 twinning Burnside to Lake Loon: Traffic volumes on this section of the Highway No. 107 exceed 15,000 vehicles per day. This section of the highway sees traffic congestion and lineups during peak commuting times. Twinning this section of the highway will reduce congestion and improve safety for our drivers. It is a continuation of Highway No. 107 twinning, extending easterly from the Highway No. 118 interchange and expanding upon the Highway No. 107 project currently under construction. Modifications to the Highway No 107, Highway No. 118 interchange are also required to accommodate the twinning. This project is expected to begin this year with clearing and bridge construction.

 

The work on the Highway No. 104 twinning project will continue this year with clearing and bridge construction to begin on the sections from Taylors Road to Paqtnkek. This highway carries a significant amount of commercial traffic from Cape Breton to Newfoundland. In the summer months this section of the Trans-Canada Highway sees up to 14,000 vehicles travel through it per day. There are also multiple at-grade intersections along this section of highway that cause a safety concern to motorists. This project will involve the construction of a wide, grassy median separating opposing traffic flows. All at-grade intersections will be removed and replaced with an interchange and other grade-separated crossings that will support local traffic movements along Trunk 4 within the adjacent communities. The project will result in the construction of approximately 11 kilometres of new Highway No. 104 twinning and over 12 kilometres of new and upgraded Trunk 4 and other local roads along the project corridor.

 

Last year I had the pleasure of announcing a new interchange which will be built in Cambridge along Highway No. 101. The new Cambridge interchange will have many benefits for the community, starting with improving safety for those travelling between Coldbrook and Berwick. It will also reduce vehicle traffic through the congested Coldbrook area, remove heavy commercial vehicles from residential roads, and provide residential and commercial development opportunities for the Annapolis Valley, the Mi'kmaq Nation, the Municipality of the County of Kings. Work will begin in the coming months, beginning with clearing and later this year, bridge construction.

 

The department also has several projects to improve safety for highways not being twinned. They include improving at-grade intersections and adding passing lanes, climbing lanes, and turning lanes. These are also very important investments, and we will continue to make our roads safer.

 

Another important piece of our transportation network in the province are our seven provincially operated ferries. There are several provincially run ferries that the Department of Public Works is responsible for operating. They include ferries in LaHave, Country Harbour, Little Narrows, Englishtown, Tancook Island, Petit Passage, and Grand Passage. Through our Five Year Highway Improvement Plan we are working on putting in place a new ferry for Tancook Island. The new ferry will allow vehicles to travel between the Tancook Islands and Blandford on the mainland. Work on infrastructure upgrades for the Tancook ferry will begin this year, which involves upgrading the wharf and road required to support the new car ferry.

 

Our department continues to be responsible for the more than 1,800 government structures and their associated properties. Buildings include provincial museums, justice centres, and government offices. Our department is also responsible for the daily operations and maintenance to ensure a safe, secure, effective, and efficient work environment for the buildings’ tenants.

 

People need to go to work, to get to appointments, and to visit with family and friends. For many of us, quality of life depends on having a driver’s licence. Over the last few years, Nova Scotians have faced longer-than-acceptable wait times to take their driving tests. We’ve always said that our government is one of solutions.

 

In February, we announced we’re adding more than 15 examiners and making the testing system more efficient. By doing this, we are cutting the waiting time in half, getting Nova Scotians a licence when they need it. Wait times are now down to three weeks or less across the province, and we aren’t stopping there.

 

I want to talk a little bit about the Traffic Safety Act. The Traffic Safety Act is an important piece of legislation intended to make the province’s roads and highways safer for motorists, cyclists, and pedestrians. This is a new, modern piece of legislation that will replace the outdated Motor Vehicle Act. The last time the Motor Vehicle Act was rewritten was the early 1920s. The way we move around the province has changed a bit since then.

 

Since the 1920s, the Act has been amended many times, creating a patchwork piece of legislation that has many parts with unclear, inconsistent, and outdated language. The new Traffic Safety Act (TSA) was introduced and passed in the Legislature in October 2018.

 

The TSA is a framework Act that sets broad policy and regulatory authority to address the more technical and day-to-day issues that arise in the administration of road safety in the province. The Act moves many technical details into regulations, which gives us more flexibility and allows us to be more responsive to emerging issues and trends.

 

Incorporating feedback from partners and interested parties was hugely important in this process. Through a public online engagement process, the department conducted an engagement to get feedback on all sections of the draft TSA regulations. Direct engagements were also conducted with 31 groups, including Cycling Nova Scotia, the Insurance Bureau of Canada, the Road Safety Advisory Committee, Nova Scotia Chiefs of Police, and the Nova Scotia Federation of Municipalities, along with 23 partner groups.

 

The Act will come into effect when regulations are finalized to support it and when the necessary IT system is ready to implement it. This Act and its regulations will impact every Nova Scotian. We must get this right and we’re taking the time needed to do just that.

 

Local transportation services are essential to help people get to work, appointments, learning opportunities, and recreational activities. These services keep us connected. Before becoming an MLA, I spent two years working with the RCMP as the Queens County Senior Safety Program coordinator. I saw first-hand the importance of community transportation.

 

It is especially important in our rural communities, which often do not have fixed-route transportation options. Many people in our rural communities rely on these services to do their everyday tasks. I am so proud that the Department of Public Works can invest in these organizations so that they can expand and continue to help people get where they need to go.

 

Annually, the province invests $7 million in fixed-route and community transit services through several grant programs. From funding studies to help operators improve their services or establish new routes to capital investments that facilitate fleet upgrades, we are working to enhance community transportation services and options to improve the quality of life for Nova Scotians in rural communities.

 

Community transportation organizations provide a vital service. The service they provide would not be possible without great Nova Scotians behind them who either work or volunteer with these organizations to strengthen our communities. I’d like to thank all of them for all that they do.

 

Transportation is also incredibly important in our more heavily populated areas of the province. We’ve invested $140 million in transit in the Halifax Regional Municipality, including $65 million for the Mill Cove ferry service from Bedford to Downtown Halifax. This project includes the purchase of five electric ferries, the construction of two terminals, and a maintenance facility. Many thought this day would never come, and I am proud that my government was able to make this dream a reality.

 

I’d like to talk a little about our Joint Reginal Transportation Agency. I call it my golden child. The Joint Reginal Transportation Agency was created in the Fall of 2021 to address transportation issues associated with rapid growth in Halifax and the surrounding communities. To carry out this mandate, the JRTA is collaborating with their partners to create a regional transportation plan. They are looking at the movement of people and goods to ensure the transportation system is prepared for our current period of unprecedented growth and will take us into the future.

 

This work will help us to ensure that our transportation system meets the evolving needs of our growing population and economy. The JRTA works with a technical advisory board with six core partners. Each partner has a wealth of transportation planning, knowledge, and experience, and has existing plans, strategies, studies, and projects that are important to, dependent on, and will inform the regional transportation plan. This includes the Halifax Regional Municipality, the Nova Scotia Department of Public Works, Halifax Harbour Bridges, the Halifax Port Authority, the Halifax International Airport Authority, the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency, and an associate member from CM.

 

The JRTA’s plan is due out at the end of this year. I’m very much looking forward to the report, and I’m extremely impressed with the progress they are making. I recently had an opportunity to do a trip with the JRTA and some of the stakeholders, and I was just absolutely impressed - quite amazed, actually - by the brains that are running this operation at the JRTA. Absolutely brilliant, passionate people who care so much about the direction that our province is going.

 

And of course, Build Nova Scotia. In December 2022, Nova Scotia Lands Incorporated, Develop Nova Scotia, and the Healthcare Infrastructure Renewal Group combined to become Build Nova Scotia. Build Nova Scotia is working to help communities reach their full potential by managing projects that improve the quality of life for Nova Scotians, strengthening our communities and growing our economy. Build Nova Scotia is responsible for the province’s HRM and CBRM health care redevelopment projects, waterfront and industrial parks development, bank asset land management, and environmental remediation. There’s a lot going on there. They’re also responsible for the Internet for Nova Scotia Initiative and the Cellular for Nova Scotia Program.

 

The Internet for Nova Scotia Initiative is a tremendous success. It has surpassed its goals, and now 97.5 per cent of Nova Scotians have access to a connection, and 100 per cent have access to satellite. The remaining areas, including approximately 10,000 civic addresses, are among the most complex, due to geography and infrastructure challenges. Build Nova Scotia is actively working with all partners to overcome these challenges and ensure the timely expansion of internet services.

 

Having reliable cell service is essential for Nova Scotians. It is a matter of safety and is something we all count on constantly. I drive Highway No. 103 often, and I know how bad cell coverage is in some of those more rural areas of the province. This has been an issue for a long time, and I am very proud to say that we are the first government in 30 years to address this very critical issue for our province. I’m very happy with the people at Build Nova Scotia that are leading this project. Very, very proud of you all. We have invested more than $47 million to improve cell services for Nova Scotians. We have already identified where gaps exist, and we’re moving quickly to improve service.

 

A little bit about Boat Harbour: We remain committed to returning Boat Harbour to its original state as a tidal estuary. This is a big project with a long history. It impacts many people in our province, and we are focused on remediating Boat Harbour as soon as possible. Work is ongoing on this project. Build Nova Scotia is working closely with Pictou Landing First Nation residents, federal and provincial regulators, technical advisors and scientists to address issues and move the project forward. Our goal is to get started on this project as soon as we have approval from the federal government to move forward.

 

[4:45 p.m.]

 

In 2018 the federal government introduced the Investing in Canada Infrastructure Program, or as we refer to it, ICIP. The program provides funding for projects such as increasing resilience to climate change, creating a clean growth economy, strengthening communities, and ensuring that Canadians have access to modern, reliable services such as public transit, water, and wastewater.

 

ICIP is a cost-share program with provinces. Through the program, $839 million in federal funding has been made available to Nova Scotia. I am very pleased to tell you that the funding has been fully assigned as of March 2023.

 

Nova Scotia has invested over $730 million in provincial spending to access ICIP funding, while municipalities and other organizations in Nova Scotia have brought forth close to $450 million. This incredible over-$2 billion investment will support 222 projects and will impact over 500 infrastructure assets province-wide. Of these, 92 projects are complete and 130 are at various stages of implementation. This program is an excellent example of what we can accomplish when we work with our government partners and other organizations to build a stronger Nova Scotia.

 

I am proud to say that our government is moving our province forward. We are committed to finishing the work that we have started. We are committed to making Nova Scotia a place where we can all live and thrive. None of this would be possible, though, without the many civil servants throughout government who are hard at work every day making our ideas a reality.

 

To finish, I would like to thank the 2,000 employees who work for the Department of Public Works for their hard work to ensure that we have safe, high-quality transportation that Nova Scotians can rely on. With that, I’ll be happy to take questions.

 

THE CHAIR: We will now take questions from the Official Opposition, with an hour for each party, starting with the Liberal caucus.

 

The honourable member for Yarmouth.

 

HON. ZACH CHURCHILL: I want to thank the staff of the Department of Public Works and the various organizations that work under Department of Public Works for their service to the public and governments of all stripes. Minister, I want to thank you for mentioning a number of projects in there too. Of particular interest to me is the Yarmouth emergency room. That is something I am very happy that the government is moving forward with.

 

For the sake of the record, I will clarify for the House that that project was announced in 2020 by Premier Stephen McNeil. The design work was completed by 2022. I’m not sure why the project was delayed for two years, but I do think we have to give credit to the local doctors who’ve been involved in this project since the beginning. They certainly put some public pressure on the government to move forward on this because they had not announced that they would be moving forward with it, as well as the people who signed a petition that I had been promoting. I do think if it wasn’t for that localized pressure, we may not have gotten an answer on this project.

 

I am very happy that that is moving forward, but that was work that began four years ago and I think could certainly have moved forward more quickly.

 

I also want to thank former Minister Lloyd Hines, who has since passed away, under the previous government for his work to ensure our highways were twinned. I’m happy that the government is so fond of those projects now because they certainly are important for safety and for the economy.

 

My first questions to the minister are related to Build Nova Scotia. Minister, there was a public tender issued for the NovaScotian Crystal building. This was issued March 10, 2022, and closed April 14, 2022. I do have information here that came from a FOIPOP that there were two bids. There was a highest-ranking bid identified, I believe, as I stated previously, that it was Benjamin Bridge, perhaps with another partner, that was to be awarded that tender, so there was a competitive bid for this. There was a public tender, a competitive bid, a recipient who was to be awarded this; however, that was cancelled in August 2025.

 

I do have some correspondence here related to that that we received through FOIPOP. I will paraphrase here, but correspondence from Develop Nova Scotia at the time before the title was changed to Build Nova Scotia, and it went from a Crown corporation to an organization under the Minister’s purview directly with the independent board and all that sort of stuff.

 

Again, we do have some correspondence here from the Develop Nova Scotia staff dated April 28, 2022: “We hope to inform the proponent within the next two weeks of their successful bid. It could be any day or week or month now.” The next response, which was in May, was redacted. Develop staff says: “I assume we aren’t in a position to now contact the proponents this week?” Again, the response is redacted.

 

On May 12, 2022, the response from the Develop Nova Scotia office is: “Yikes. Okay. Thanks for the heads up. I will carry on with the review phase language and let him know that as soon as we have an update, we will provide it.”

 

July 18^th: “Crown review ongoing. Continues delay of decision-making.” August 8, 2022: “I think at this point you could simply reply that the properties in this subject have an open procurement. Until such a time that is consummated or terminated, we aren’t able to entertain any proposals.”

 

AllNovaScotia on September 25^th: “Could you please tell me why this tender was cancelled?” Again, redacted information from the staff. It says: “Staff debating messaging,” almost completely redacted, but it did include language that “We are still going through approvals here but will get back to you ASAP. In the meantime, wanted to flag the department has asked that you also get Wayne’s sign-off on this one.”

 

Presumably that would be Wayne Crawley, who was, according to the Premier, the personal friend who was appointed to take over in the interim at Build Nova Scotia. The media request is not returned because it did not get sign-off from Wayne. Then we do have a response that was approved by Wayne which confirms that that tender was cancelled.

 

Could the Minister please tell the House why that public tender was cancelled, after a successful recipient was found and that underwent a competitive procurement for that?

 

KIM MASLAND: The member is correct. This was a tender that had closed, and certainly I understand that this was difficult news for the proponent to receive, but with the new Build Nova Scotia we are looking at and rethinking the entire jewel of Halifax - which is what we call it, you know, the Halifax Waterfront - rethinking the entire plans for the entire waterfront as a whole. Yes, there is no one in that building right now, but Build Nova Scotia continues to look at how we will plan that entire waterfront going forward.

 

ZACH CHURCHILL: Again, the concern here is that we underwent a public tender where there was a preferred proponent that had undergone a competitive process. By all accounts, it was going to have a pretty impactful and exciting product there on the waterfront. Furthermore, there is concern on this because this did happen again with the Visitor Information Centre, as I understand it, where I believe there was another public tender for the Visitor Information Centre. Again, a preferred proponent was found, then that was also cancelled, potentially by the government.

 

Could the minister confirm that that did happen a second time with the Visitor Information Centre? The first building was the old NovaScotian Crystal building, but this did happen again with the Visitor Information Centre on the waterfront. Could the minister please confirm that?

 

KIM MASLAND: You are correct with that, but that was withdrawn to continue with Build Nova Scotia’s mandate of looking at overall planning for the waterfront. This is not happening just at the waterfront. We withdrew a BDO in Lunenburg once; I think it was down in the waterfront in Lunenburg. It’s all about strategic planning and making sure we’re putting the right people - or the right businesses - in there that will fit into that overall planning for Build Nova Scotia.

 

ZACH CHURCHILL: These are both properties that abut the Queen’s Marque building, which would be a signature complex with restaurants, a hotel, and office spaces, I believe. Both of these buildings abut that. Of course, that building was developed and built by Scott McCrea, who is the Transition Chair of the Premier, a fundraiser for the Premier, and, we’ve heard, has taken meetings on behalf of the Premier with universities that are looking at housing projects and with developers, as well.

 

We’ve also heard that Mr. McCrea may have had influence on the cancelling of these tenders. I would like to ask the minister if the Premier’s Transition Chair was involved in these conversations and if the Premier’s Transition Chair had conversations with the minister, Build Nova Scotia staff, or previous Develop Nova Scotia staff in relation to these two buildings and the tenders that were released. I would like the minister to tell the House if Mr. McCrea’s influence had an impact on the decision to cancel these tenders.

 

KIM MASLAND: I’m not aware of any conversations. I’ve had no conversations, and I’m not aware of Build Nova Scotia staff having conversations.

 

ZACH CHURCHILL: I hope that this would be something that would be of concern to the minister if there was truth to it. Both these buildings abut the Queen’s Marque facility. We have heard from people in the business community, as well as folks involved with these tenders, that there has been influence there. I would like to ask the minister if she or her staff are aware of any efforts by Mr. McCrea or conversations within Build Nova Scotia related to these, if there’s been any interest indicated by Mr. McCrea on wishing to own these parcels, or if he has presented any potential ideas for development of those two parcels.

 

KIM MASLAND: I appreciate my honourable colleague’s comments, but again, I personally have not had any meetings, and I’m not aware of Build Nova Scotia - nor am I aware of Mr. MacRae - wanting to purchase those buildings.

 

ZACH CHURCHILL: Would the minister please chat with Build Nova Scotia staff and investigate whether any conversations happened with Mr. MacRae in relation to this?

 

Again, the concern would just be that there would be undue influence by someone who’s closely tied, from a partisan perspective, with the Premier and the organization, and who obviously would have a very personalized interest in those two buildings. But the very impressive and beautiful development that’s there with the Queen’s Marque facility - our interest in this is just that there are fair competitive processes that all companies are able to compete for with the purchase and development of these properties, so that we ensure we’re getting the very best outcomes for people. If the minister could confirm that that’s a conversation that she’ll have with her staff, and if there’s anything that’s discovered, maybe she could report back to the House.

 

[5:00 p.m.]

 

KIM MASLAND: Absolutely, I will have a chat with the folks at Build Nova Scotia.

 

ZACH CHURCHILL: I do trust the minister at her word, and I look forward to having a follow-up conversation with her once she’s been able to have those conversations.

 

Another item where I also do have confidence in this minister, because she knows the importance of it to our part of the province - this minister is a fellow member representing the beautiful South Shore, like me. I’m all the way down at the end of the South Shore, in the Valley, in Yarmouth. The minister knows the critical nature of the Nova Scotia to Maine international ferry service. Of course, we’ve had an international ferry service connecting Nova Scotia through Yarmouth to Maine for over 150 years now. I know the minister values that service. She knows how critical it is for resorts in her constituency like White Point Beach Resort - I believe 50 per cent of their American visitors come off that service, as well as The Quarterdeck Resort and all the other smaller resorts, Airbnbs, and inns in Queens County which have been doing very well over the last number of years, particularly since that ferry service was restored.

 

I certainly love visiting Queens with my family. White Point is certainly a favourite - great for the kids, with bunnies and a pool and all the programming designed for families and children. It’s really spectacular.

 

When the ferry was cut by the NDP in 2009, that probably helped the member get elected, actually, because it was an NDP member at the time who held that seat. I remember the damage to White Point’s room nights, the impact to the tourism sector in Queens County in particular because it is such a heavy tourism economy there, among other things. Particularly in Yarmouth, even Shelburne, all the way up through your riding, Chair, into Halifax.

 

I do want to ask a few questions about the ferry service. Thankfully, Tourism Nova Scotia has done a really robust review of this. The reason I want to ask these questions is because the government has decided to review the ferry service. They’re doing an economic study of it. Again, this is after years of the Premier, when he was in Opposition, attacking the value of this service, suing the company Bay Ferries, making claims that there was no value for dollars that were invested. This does seem to be the only issue the Premier pretends to be a fiscal conservative on, of course, because money for everything else has gone out the door in the amounts of billions of dollars beyond the Premier’s own budget.

 

The rationale given that we have to look after taxpayers’ money on this - I don’t think that is a motivating factor for the government’s decisions, first and foremost. More importantly, I think the Department of Communities, Culture, Tourism and Heritage has done a really good job doing an economic analysis of the impact of the ferry service through surveys, particularly with visitors. That’s something that I want to discuss with the minister.

 

The Department of Communities, Culture, Tourism and Heritage did a visitor exit survey. They found some very important data related to that ferry service. I want to go through that. They found that the majority of visitors from Maine to Nova Scotia through the international ferry link were Americans coming here, not Nova Scotians going to the U.S. That’s significant, because that’s where the economic benefit of that service is. It’s in connecting us to one of the largest tourism markets in the world, so we want to see the number of passengers on that ferry service being from the United States coming here.

 

They found that 83 per cent of passengers on the ferry service were Americans coming here, which is what we want to see. Close to 90 per cent of those travellers were coming for pleasure. They weren’t coming to visit friends; they were coming for the tourism experience here in Nova Scotia. So 86 per cent of visitors were coming here to spend money on tourism products.

 

The survey also found that the overall visitor population of people visiting Nova Scotians on the service, compared to people travelling into the province through other ferries or driving in particular, that the party composition was, 51 per cent of the time and above, a couple. Compare that to the overall visitation to Nova Scotia being 37 per cent folks who are a couple. Off the ferry, it’s 51 per cent. That means it’s more people travelling on the ferry service. The visitor party size is larger off the Maine to Nova Scotia ferry. That service reported larger party sizes compared with the overall visitor population, with six in ten reporting a party size of two and one third reporting a party size of three or more. You compare that with having two people or more visiting, that’s 48 per cent of the parties that come in by other means to Nova Scotia; 59 per cent of folks coming off the ferry are larger parties.

 

The number of nights stayed is also higher coming off that ferry service. When you compare the amount of people coming into Nova Scotia who stay say eight nights or more, which is a very high-value stay, the overall population of visitors coming into the province who stay eight nights or more is 21 per cent. If you look at those coming off the ferry, it’s 31 per cent, so 10 per cent more people coming into Nova Scotia through that ferry service are staying eight days or more, which is really exciting. Six days or more, 15 per cent of passengers are doing that, compared with 6 per cent of the overall. Close to 60 per cent - 58 per cent - were actually first-time visitors.

 

Furthermore, we have a great indicator here that 60 per cent of people coming into Nova Scotia are first-time visitors who probably wouldn’t have come to our province through other means. Again, the reason for that is because Bar Harbor is a domestic tourism destination for Americans. They have 10,000 people who live on Grand Desert year-round. The population in the Summer during the COVID years was around four million people, and that was in a down year for domestic tourism in the United States. It’s no surprise that 58 per cent of people - close to 60 per cent - are coming for the first time because of that ferry service.

 

On the accommodations side, the Maine to Nova Scotia ferry passengers were more likely than visitors overall to stay in paid accommodations as well, and less likely to stay with friends and family - again, high-value visitors who are 12 per cent more likely to stay at places they’re paying for. Fifty-eight percent of those folks stay in hotels, compared with 46 per cent of people who travel overall staying in hotels. Nineteen per cent stay in motels, compared with 7 per cent of travellers overall who stay in motels. Twenty per cent stay in bed-and-breakfasts, compared with 6 per cent who come in from other areas.

 

If you look at how many people come into Nova Scotia not through the ferry service, 38 per cent of those folks - close to 40 per cent of those folks - are staying with friends and family, compared with 17 per cent who come off the ferry. If you look at campgrounds, it’s 7 per cent to 15 per cent. If you look at other fixed-roof accommodations - that would be Airbnbs, cottages, these sorts of rentals - it’s 50 per cent compared to 26 per cent of people who travel in from other places.

 

Then there’s a breakdown here - I’ll table this so the House can have it - a breakdown of fixed-room accommodations. Again, across the board you’re seeing travellers who come into Nova Scotia through Yarmouth, through that ferry service, almost double staying at places that they’re paying for, compared to people coming in from other places.

 

I think the most exciting stat that Tourism found - again, this is all coming from the provincial Department of Communities, Culture, Tourism and Heritage - was the overall spend. This is also really exciting. The overall spend per party per trip - again, the overall visitors, so that’s people who are coming in by other means to Nova Scotia - is around $1,818. If you look at the Maine to Nova Scotia passengers, they’re spending $2,541.

 

We have a really compelling story here from the Department of Communities, Culture, Tourism and Heritage that tells us that visitors coming over from Maine to Nova Scotia are mostly new first-time visitors. They’re bigger parties, they stay longer, they spend more money, therefore, the economic impact is quite considerable.

 

If you look at the numbers of the spend compared to the numbers and multiply that by the parties, we’re looking at, last year, over $30 million that was brought into our economy that’s new. That’s using the 83 per cent figure, the spend with the overall passengers. We see that the Department of Communities, Culture, Tourism and Heritage did a really thorough job of looking at the value for money on this service. Again, one can use this data to point to the fact that there’s between an 80 per cent and 100 per cent return on investment in that ferry service.

 

I’m wondering why, since the Department of Communities, Culture, Tourism and Heritage is providing this and really has done an incredible job of looking at all the numbers that matter - how much money is being spent, how long people are staying, how many of them are coming here, how many of them are American - what else are the government’s consultants looking at that would be different from the overall numbers presented by the Department of Communities, Culture, Tourism and Heritage?

 

[5:15 p.m.]

 

KIM MASLAND: I expected this question to come from the member. First, it’s certainly great to see you in Queens County, and any time you would like to come visit, we’ll take your money. Bring your family and visit the bunnies and the resorts. Don’t just stay at one, stay at two: one in the Best Western - you can stay there, too - maybe at Lane’s Privateer Inn for the night. We’ll plan a whole trip for you while you’re there.

 

One of the things - sorry, I just couldn’t let this go. Earlier, in one of our Question Periods, I heard the member say that the PC Party over here is always data-driven. They’re data-driven. Well, a lot of data there you just gave me. Data, I guess, is part of government. Let’s not just point fingers at data when you want it to work your way.

 

I have had this conversation with the member many times. Yes, I live on the South Shore, the western part of the province. I have two resorts in my constituency, which I know receive traffic and visitors who come across on the ferry. I am also the Minister of Public Works. I understand the member’s passion in representing his area and fighting for his area. I do the same in mine, but I’m also the Minister of Public Works, which means I can’t just look at something for one area. I must look at what the value is going to be for that service for the entire province.

 

The member says that doing this study - I have said to the member on previous occasions that we need to make sure that this service is providing value for taxpayers’ dollars. We are the government. We need to make sure we’re spending taxpayers’ dollars in the right way, that’s the most valuable to them, and that’s what I’m going to do. That’s why we decided to do the broad impact study.

 

I’m going to read it to the member. The study involves:

 

the development of a visitor expenditure profile understanding traffic flows, visitors and citizens using the service, accessing the true impact on tourism operators in southwestern Nova Scotia and across the province, and bringing clarity to the overall economic benefits and costs of the ferry to the province and its taxpayers. It’s looking at the direct, the indirect, and the induced impacts of the service.

 

This is a longer-period study. It’s not to discredit anything the tourism industry is putting forward with figures. The tourism industry is part of this impact study. They are participating in this. I know the member had asked to be part of this impact study and to be able to meet with the consultants who are doing this study. I know the member was not happy with the people who were awarded the RFP to do this study. I’m pleased with the work they’re doing and the engagement they’re doing. I know they have reached out to the member’s constituency office and asked for a meeting with him. I understand that’s going to happen when he’s not so busy. That will be good for him, to be able to have that and to offer his comments.

 

It’s not to discredit the figures and the data that the Department of Communities, Culture, Tourism and Heritage has already provided. That’s not it at all. Their part of the study is to do a broad economic impact study to prove to Nova Scotians the value of this service. I realize that the member’s very passionate. It’s in his backyard. You know what? I have people in my constituency, on the other end, who feel that this service is a waste of money. We have to be able to prove to Nova Scotians, for the first time - we are the first government that has actually taken this on and is doing a broad economic impact study to try to figure it out.

 

The sad part of it is this ferry has literally been kicked around like a football - a political football - NDPs, Tories, Liberals, back and forth. We have been talking about this long before I was even involved in politics. Finally, a government that is going to actually do it. We said what we are going to do. We need to prove to taxpayers that this is good value for their money. I will always do that.

 

Do I believe the service is valuable to my constituency? One hundred per cent. I have people who use that service, the people who come into my resorts; but I am now the Minister of Public Works, I have to be responsible to all Nova Scotians and making sure the money is being spent wisely.

 

ZACH CHURCHILL: Again, my concern is more around the politics of this, and I am concerned not with the minister’s intention but more with the Premier’s intention and his staff’s intention on this. This has been a political football because first, former Premier Darrell Dexter cutting the service without doing any analysis of the economic impact, and secondly because the current Premier and the PC Leader previous - even though they were the party that brought Bay Ferries to Nova Scotia, that brought The CAT to Yarmouth originally - it’s because the leadership of that party has, in a very sustained way, attacked the value of the service without taking into consideration the economic impact.

 

If you look at eight years that we were in government, you will also see eight years of Jamie Baillie and then the current Premier, lambasting this thing, suing a private company to get the management fee, which was 3 per cent, the smallest management fee you’ll see for anything. Again, the Premier who now hides millions of dollars, potentially, from public awareness of money that might be going to someone he is closely linked with.

 

I am not concerned about the economics of this, because to correct the minister, there actually have been several studies done on this. I believe ACOA has been involved, Chambers of Commerce have been involved in a study, there was an international ferry partnership study that was commissioned; so the minister is not the first one to look at the economics of this. There have been several studies. I will now table the study that I was referencing, which was done by the Department of Tourism.

 

This is something that has been looked at. We know that whatever people’s feelings are on this - and again, the negativity really has come from, very obviously, the attacks that the Leader of the PCs and the former Leader of the PCs have levelled, which weren’t well-informed, which ignored the economic impact, and were more about politics than anything.

 

My concern is not necessarily with the individuals who have been awarded this contract, but I was concerned that these two individuals just so happened to register their business with the Registry of Joint Stock Companies a month or two before this tender came out. I am worried that because they are being paid by the government and the public wasn’t provided with what the competitive information was for that tender, we don’t know if this was the highest-value proponent or not to do this. There are other, bigger companies that have records of doing this that weren’t chosen. This company was chosen. Again, the timing of them going to the Registry of Joint Stock Companies and getting registered as a company coincided with this.

 

I am suspicious of the process here. Again, it’s not because of the minister, because I trust the minister’s intentions on this, but at the end of the day it’s the Premier and his office that are going to make the call on this.

 

Through FOIPOP I had another correspondence here from Nicole LaFosse Parker to James Mitchener - that would be the Chief of Staff for the Premier to the Director of Operations - the question she asked again, all I can find that is not redacted here is: “Do you know if we received any input from Zach on this” - presumably that’s me - “and what he wanted to see,?” and that ideally we didn’t. If we did, I’m curious what, if anything, he suggests was incorporated in here.

 

We have indications that there’s a political lens being put on this where I’m even being referenced as the MLA for the area. Why wouldn’t the chief of staff to the Premier, if this was a real economic study, want me to provide any input on this? Ideally, we didn’t hear from him. I’ve gotten more information on this than probably anybody else in the House, and I’ll table that.

 

My concern is - and I’m not going to ask another question on this - not with the minister or her staff. Again, I do trust this minister as a minister who has always been honest with me as far as I’ve ever known, who I know knows the value of this and experienced the value in her constituency.

 

I do worry about the individuals who are making the calls on this, because of the politics they’ve played with this issue, because of how these proponents were chosen, and because it seems to be the only thing that the government cares about being fiscally conservative on - value for money. The Auditor General has pointed out that in hundreds of millions of dollars of government spending, due diligence was never done, and need was not even demonstrated. On this particular issue, all of a sudden, they really care about being fiscally responsible.

 

Just a few notes that I’ll note to the minister before I pass it on to my colleague is that we do know that 60 per cent of people travelling through that service are coming all the way to Halifax through her riding. Less so through the Valley, but a little bit through the Valley, and 40 per cent of those visitors get all the way up to Cape Breton. We are not just seeing a regional impact for this service in our areas, but we are seeing a regional impact all the way into HRM and into Cape Breton, which I think is important for all members of this House to know as well.

 

With those quick comments, I will pass it on to my colleague. I thank the minister for her diligence on this. Our hope is in her on this file, and of course all the members who do know the critical importance of this service, which has been there for 150 years uninterrupted until 2009.

 

THE CHAIR: The honourable member for Annapolis.

 

CARMAN KERR: I’ll be fairly brief this year, compared to past years.

 

THE CHAIR: Order. Can I ask that you move your microphone back? We’re not allowed to touch them, but I have trouble hearing you. There we go.

 

The honourable member for Annapolis.

 

CARMAN KERR: I’ll be fairly brief. I think I’ve only got about 19 minutes.

 

I wanted to raise the issue with the tidal project and the causeway in Annapolis Royal. I raised it last year in Estimates. What I asked last year was about a letter sent from the Town of Annapolis and the County of Annapolis that was dated March 31^st. I do see that a reply was sent a couple of weeks ago. It took a while, almost a year, to get back to those two groups.

 

My questions were, at the time, about a detailed engineering assessment. I think that was the request from both the county and the town. It looks like, in the letter response from the minister and the department on March 20^th, the department has committed to an engineering assessment to be planned over the coming year. Is that correct?

 

HON. KIM MASLAND: First of all, I would like to comment on the length of time for that letter. It’s not acceptable. I was certainly not happy when I saw that that letter was missed. It got missed on a desk. We’ve addressed it, and yes, we are committed to doing an assessment.

 

CARMAN KERR: I wasn’t trying to make a dig. I just think I saw that just now that it took that long, but that’s okay. We’re moving on.

 

The letter does say that the department staff are reviewing previous assessments and developing criteria for an updated engineering assessment. I guess where I’m going with that is, knowing full well that Nova Scotia Power would be involved, there’d be a series of steps that Nova Scotia Power would have to go through.

 

I wonder if the minister could comment on what steps the department is able to take in parallel with Nova Scotia Power. Does the department have to wait until certain steps are taken by Nova Scotia Power? This is just so I can report back, maybe not to the town and the county - they may know before I do - but to residents who may ask me that.

 

KIM MASLAND: We actually have a meeting scheduled with Nova Scotia Power in April. I think once we have the opportunity to sit down and talk to them, we could probably give you more of an update on where we’ll go forward and how we can work concurrently together on different things. Certainly, we’re looking at the structural integrity of the causeway and how the water control structures will be maintained or managed.

 

CARMAN KERR: That’s great that there’s a meeting planned for April. There is a comment in this letter, again, and I’ll quote: “I’ll have staff reach out to you by May.” So that’s to the Warden of Annapolis County and the Mayor of Annapolis. They’re talking about “with an update on status and scope of the review,” and how “engagement is important.” Just wondering what that engagement will look like. There’ll be that meeting in April, and then - it’s hard to predict the future, but any idea of how that engagement will continue throughout the year and onto the next?

 

KIM MASLAND: Basically, like I mentioned earlier, this meeting in April will really set out how we’ll be able to work with stakeholders going forward. The reason why we responded with the May date is to have that meeting with Nova Scotia Power. Right now the causeway is owned by the Province, but Nova Scotia Power is actually managing it. I think once we have that initial meeting, we’ll be able to work through, and then our hope is to be able to work with the municipalities and update stakeholders from there.

 

[5:30 p.m.]

 

CARMAN KERR: Thank you to the minister. I appreciate that. If she or the department could update me along the way, or I could reach out to the town and county - but either way, it would be great to get some information.

 

The second topic - I feel like it’s déjà vu, it’s the same thing I raised last year as well. It’s the Rice connector. I’ve flagged it with - I see the minister looking up, but I’ve flagged it with different staff. Last year, if you allow me to quote myself: “The Rice connector is a concrete-built on-ramp outside of Bridgetown, connecting Rice Road to Highway No. 101.” I talk about talking to senior staff. They’re aware of it. Some of the senior staff in the department have actually driven it, and last year I said: “It’s not in great shape. It’s in bad shape.” Well, this year it’s in horrible shape. Terrible shape. I don’t know what adjective to use to say that it’s a year worse than it was. It’s not driveable in some places.

 

We’re talking about an on ramp/off ramp. It was called the Rice connector. The department staff know a lot more about the history than I do. I get several correspondences on it. It was built with the local company, VJ Rice Concrete Limited, who are on that road. It’s made of concrete, so it’s unique in that sense.

 

Last year the Minister said: “I’ve been advised that staff are looking at several options but I don’t have details,” and that was fair. I’m wondering now, a year later: Could the minister elaborate on some of the options for that Rice connector that is now in horrible shape?

 

KIM MASLAND: I want the member to know that I actually did go down and travel that road myself, so I know it’s not in good condition, or any other adjective that you want to use.

 

The problem with this road is this is a multi-million-dollar expense. This is a very expensive project; $5 million to $6 million to probably look at fixing. I know it is scheduled for the future, for 2027-2028. That’s too far out - I understand that.

 

I think what we may have to look at doing is trying to break it up into smaller projects because $5 million to $7 million just doesn’t fit into the budget right now. Certainly, I know the state this road is in and it’s not in good condition at all.

 

I think if you could work with the district or work with the chief engineer in trying to see if we can break this down, instead of doing the whole 8.2 kilometres at once, maybe do it over a couple of years, it may be a little bit easier to try to get things going there.

 

CARMAN KERR: I am very grateful for the work that has been done on Highway No. 101 in different sections. I think what I am hearing is this is part and parcel of the work being done on the actual Highway No. 101 road, this off-ramp. Highway No. 101 is actually in much better shape than the actual on-ramp and off-ramp. I don’t know if the department is able to leapfrog that off-ramp or that on-ramp before the work is done on Highway No. 101. No one complains about that stretch of Highway No. 101 - you’re doing good work, you’re doing 5 or 6 k’s at a time. They understand that.

 

What they don’t understand, what I don’t understand is, this is the third year I’ve brought it up. I’m thankful for lots of things going on with the department, but the third year bringing it up, it’s getting worse and worse. People are asking me: What’s the holdup?

 

Is there any way the minister or the department would consider looking at the on-ramp or off-ramp separate and earlier than the rest of the work on the actual Highway No. 101?

 

KIM MASLAND: Absolutely. That’s something that we can look at, doing that and breaking it up. I think that’s going to make it a lot easier for us and for you to see some improvements there. Certainly, you could work with our chief engineer and the district. We can look at trying to do that.

 

CARMAN KERR: I think the chief engineer is nearby, as well. Is there anything in the budget this year that would help us address - you mentioned 2026-27, but is there anything in the budget that would help us address that on-ramp/off-ramp this coming year?

 

KIM MASLAND: I will check with the chief engineer. I’m not sure what his priorities are and what his budget is right now. Certainly, we can work with him, and I’ll get back to you or he’ll get back to you.

 

THE CHAIR: The honourable member for Annapolis, with a note that there are six minutes remaining.

 

CARMAN KERR: I certainly don’t want to go back and forth here about the same issue, but I appreciate the minister looking at that. I hope she understands that we’re just looking for something to be done right away.

 

Just to switch, with only five and a half minutes, there was a consulting report on our Lequille Base, and recommendations were given to fix up our Lequille Base. We had an issue where brine, or a high level of salt, was leaking into the ground. I can table this report.

 

This is back in 2021, and I’ve brought it up before. I think it’s slowly being remedied. There’s a recommendation for construction of a permanent roof over the solar salt shed. My first question is: Can the minister confirm that was completed?

 

KIM MASLAND: Yes.

 

CARMAN KERR: That was completed. I appreciate that. The second recommendation was to pave the solar salt transfer area between the salt storage and the brine production building. Do we know if that second recommendation to pave that area was completed?

 

KIM MASLAND: It’s another quick answer: Yes.

 

CARMAN KERR: Two for two. Number three on the recommendations list was to add a waste tank near the brine production building to receive discharge from mixer cleaning. I’m just wondering if that’s been completed as well.

 

[5:45 p.m.]

 

KIM MASLAND: I’m going to have to look into that. I don’t have an answer for you right now.

 

CARMAN KERR: I think the fourth one - what I’m going to do is table this report. Again, it’s going back a few years. I think slowly everything has been almost completed or fully completed. My concern is, as recently as in the last five months, another household contacted me, saying that in either drilling for a well or looking for water, they’re running into the same problems: so much salt, and they believe it’s an issue to do with the salt shed, similar to other properties in the area. I said I would reach out to the department and figure this out. I also said that I would get an update on this report, because I had no idea at the time. I’m certainly happy if the minister or an area manager could follow up and give me more clarity on that as well.

 

Just quickly, with a minute, a couple of roads that I’m interested in, if the department could get back to me. Haddock Alley - there’s a discrepancy because two years ago it was considered a road that the department would take care of and now it’s not. I forget the terminology.

 

We have a construction and demolition disposal site on Arlington Road. We’ve got so many people complaining about the condition of the road. It’s owned by Dexter Construction. I wonder if the minister and the department would consider - I know what the answer is - paving the road or chip sealing, double chip sealing or something. The road is just in a terrible state, and it continues to be.

 

My third ask would be Stoney Beach Road. I brought it up before. Currently the Department of Agriculture is doing a lot of work on our marshlands down there and they’ll be using that road. I’m just hoping that the Department of Agriculture and the Department of Public Works could take good care of that road once they’ve used it.

 

THE CHAIR: Order. The time for the Liberal caucus has expired. We will now have an hour for the NDP.

 

The honourable member for Cape Breton Centre-Whitney Pier.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: Thank you, Minister, and your staff for being here. Let’s talk about some roads first, and I’ll let you know when I’m moving on to different sections.

 

The budget includes $36 million for the Rural Impact Mitigation program for maintenance and repair of the rural roads. I’m just wondering: With regard to the zones, how will this money be allocated and how is the department choosing which roads to repair, with regard to RIM?

 

KIM MASLAND: The first question is a great opportunity to talk a bit about our RIM project. When we took government, the RIM - under the Liberal government - was $11 million. We have now tripled it to $36 million - actually, more than tripled - under the RIM program. This is pavement-patching, this is culverts, this is ditching, this is guard rail, and this is brush-cutting.

 

We know how important our rural roads are to Nova Scotians, so we have made the investments into RIM, just like we’ve made investments into capital gravel road programs.

 

To answer the member’s question on how it is allocated: It is divided up based on the number of kilometres within the district. It goes out to the district manager, they figure out the number of kilometres, and then it’s divided up that way. It looks like approximately $2 million would go to Cape Breton County for RIM work.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: In the municipal MOU back in October, there was the existence of Schedule A - before it was removed - that basically said the Province would, under Schedule A, no longer be paving or repaving local roads. Instead, they’d let them go to gravel unless the municipalities wanted to take them over.

 

Although Schedule A has been removed from that MOU and is in negotiations, I’m wondering: Is this the policy now in the Department of Public Works with regards to the repaving and paving of local roads?

 

KIM MASLAND: I am assuming the member is talking about the J-Class program. No? I don’t know what you’re talking about, then. The J-Class program has remained the same.

 

THE CHAIR: Before I recognize the honourable member for Cape Breton Centre-Whitney Pier, I’d would like to make a couple of reminders. You are not allowed to eat in this Chamber. I also find the conversations have moved from a whisper to an inside voice, so if we could please keep it down to respect the members who have the floor, that would be great.

 

The honourable member for Cape Breton Centre-Whitney Pier.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: I am talking about local roads. Once that Schedule A was made public, people became concerned about the local roads no longer being paved by the Department of Public Works, due to what was in Schedule A. It has since been removed. I am just wondering if we can get clarification about that. Is the department finally going to be paving these local roads that are in desperate need - in my riding and in others - or is the department’s plan not to pave these local provincial roads?

 

[6:00 p.m.]

 

KIM MASLAND: I thank my honourable colleague for the question, and I certainly appreciate her shout-out to the Department of Public Works staff who worked so hard over that storm. I think I mentioned earlier today in Question Period that we had over 60,000 hours of operating gear. The men and women who work with the Department of Public Works were working 24 hours right around the clock, with over 400 pieces of equipment we had in Cape Breton, and I must say - only 5 per cent breakage. When you have a storm of that amount of weight and snow, 150 centimetres, the way the department worked through that was absolutely incredible. A huge shout-out to our contractors.

 

For the Department of Public Works Winter operations, we staff up and we have equipment that would handle up to 50 centimeters of snow. Anything after that, we would usually reach out to our contractors.

 

We have a great relationship with our contractors and they do fabulous work for us when we’re into these types of events. No, I can’t see us going out and buying 400 more snowplows or snowblowers and sticking them in a shed and waiting for a snowstorm to come in 10 more years. No, I can’t see that. I can see us working very collaboratively with our road-building industry and our contractors to make sure that we have them, and of course, our neighbouring province, which we’ve done in the past and it’s always been successful.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: Private roads are not maintained by the government. However, during severe circumstances like CBRM had in February, where actually 200 centimetres of snow was reported to have fallen, is the government thinking of a policy that would allow for the plowing of private roads for circumstances such as this?

 

KIM MASLAND: The answer is no. We have a private road policy for a reason. Many of these private roads, we cannot even get our snow clearing equipment down them. We have to think about protecting our own equipment and gear.

 

Certainly, during the last snowstorm the message was very loud and clear - I did it in a scrum - that if someone was stranded to please let us know. I actually remember getting a phone call from someone in Cape Breton who needed dialysis the next morning and was trapped. It wasn’t a provincial road; it was a road that was maintained by CBRM. We had one of our snowplows go down in the middle of the night so this gentleman could get out to get his dialysis the next morning. He had already missed one treatment.

 

No, the private road policy is not going to change. It’s there for a reason, but certainly there are contractors out there who are also willing to help. During that unprecedented snowstorm, the message was clear that no one would be trapped. I’m not prepared to review or change the private road policy.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: I respect that there are situations - we have policies for a reason. I think I might have to disagree with not looking at the extreme weather that we were in, considering we couldn’t even get contractors out to plow driveways. Everybody was flat-out. Those are the extreme circumstances I’m talking about, when we’re in these situations that are severe and dangerous. We might have a little disagreement on that, but I respect the fact that the minister answered the question.

 

Before I leave roads, I want to talk about ditches. I’m sure the minister is aware - because I talk about ditches all the time - but we’re continuing to receive ongoing complaints across the province about ditch maintenance near provincial roads. Without proper drainage and maintenance, the ditches cause flooding and freezing conditions on the roads. What is the budget for ditch maintenance this year? Have there been any increases? Does this reflect the damage caused by these extreme storms from last year?

 

KIM MASLAND: Our drainage maintenance for 2024-25 will be $14.5 million, just for drainage. That’s culvert replacement and ditching. What the member should also know is that when we’re doing any local trunk and route upgrades, we’re also doing ditching there and replacing culverts. Of course, as you’ve heard me say before, under all projects that we do now, we’re looking at the climate readiness or the climate lens. We’re replacing our culverts with bigger culverts so we can make sure they can handle any extreme events that may be on their way.

 

Of course, a lot of it falls under the RIM project. Think about it. Under the Liberal government, the RIM was $11 million. It is now $36 million. That is significant. When you have an $11 million RIM budget, we’ve got a lot of catch-up to do. We’re certainly doing that. We’ve invested into our RIM and $14 million into pipes, drainage, and ditching. Is it enough? Probably not, but it’s certainly getting us where we need to go when we’re playing catch-up.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: I’ve got a question or two about bridges, and I think that is aptly important as of what we just saw come out of the U.S. today. I know it was the talk in our office. A 2023 Auditor General follow-up report found that six recommendations from the 2019 report regarding bridge projects have not been met. She noted that the slow implementation of the recommendations poses a risk to public safety. What was the rationale behind the delay of the implementation of these recommendations, and did the Auditor General recommend the approach taken by this government, which involved attaining new technology?

 

KIM MASLAND: Mostly what the AG was talking about was the new bridge software program we had. We met with the AG last week to update them on the project - on the software implementation. That will be in full swing this month. It wasn’t as if we’re still not out there doing our bridge inspections. We’re still doing our Level 1, Level 2, and Level 3 inspections, so it wasn’t as if those were not being done. This was real-time data, decision tree, and better support in making those decisions.

 

My understanding is that the AG is content. The software will go live this month, but we have 4,100 bridges in this province. We are a government that, for two years in a row now, has doubled the Bridge Rehabilitation Program: $60 million last year and $60 million this year. I think we have 54 bridge design packages ready to go this year. This is up significantly from the usual range of 20 to 30 bridges each year. That’s a result of the investment that our government is putting into our bridges.

 

The response to the July 2023 flooding - we had significant damage to our bridge infrastructure during that flood. Thirteen of those are full replacements, and those are done. We know the integral role or part of the transportation network that bridges play - 4,100 bridges. That’s a lot of bridges in a small province. We’ll keep investing, and I’m glad to see that our software will be up and running at the end of the month.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: I’m just wondering: Can the minister tell me how many of the six outstanding recommendations have now been implemented?

 

KIM MASLAND: All the recommendations are now complete.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: That’s great to hear - very helpful. The AG’s report found that the department was not completing regular bridge inspections as required by the department policy. I was wondering if the minister could explain this. Are inspections currently overdue? If they are, do we know which bridges that has occurred in?

 

KIM MASLAND: Level 1 inspection status - updated March 21, 2024 - 87.9 per cent have had a Level 1 inspection. Level 2 inspection - the same date - 99.1 per cent. We’ll be finishing off the rest before the date to the year, which is either July or August.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: In other provinces, they publish conditions of bridges. I’m wondering: Will the province publish the condition and related targets for bridge conditions?

 

KIM MASLAND: The reason why we don’t put all this information on a website is because it’s highly technical. I’m not an engineer - definitely not a bridge structure engineer - so to put all that information out to the public could certainly cause confusion.

 

[6:15 p.m.]

 

If our bridges are not safe - we do inspections on them - we close them. We’re not going to have people out there driving across bridges that are not safe.

 

The information can be released through FOIPOP, but we do not have a website set up that is going to list every bridge inspection. That is going to cause tons of confusion with folks in the public.

 

THE CHAIR: Order. I ask the member for Kings South to please respect the people who have the floor.

 

The honourable member for Cape Breton Centre-Whitney Pier.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: The only reason I ask is because other provinces do it, and I’m not hearing anything scary coming out of those provinces, that people are all scared about the bridges. I think actually it creates for them more safety - they actually feel safer knowing what the bridge conditions are. It provides a little bit more security, actually. Maybe it would be something the minister might want to look into: talk to counterparts in other provinces about what the reality might be on the ground for people.

 

I want to turn to a little bit of Hogan Court to discuss this. In the AG’s report on Hogan Court, it stated: “Public Works played a supporting role, providing feedback on

building quality and the reasonability of the construction budget based on the assumption limited renovations were needed. Public Works was responsible for the conversion of the property until May 2023 when the project was transferred to Build Nova Scotia as part of their Healthcare Infrastructure Division.”

 

According to the AG’s report, the minister’s department was granted approval from the government to sign an MOU between NSHA and Cresco. Why was the MOU signed with the developer and not with the actual property owner, and where did this decision originate?

 

KIM MASLAND: I’d like to be able to answer the honourable member’s question, but I’m not the Minister of Health and Wellness. That file is with the Minister Health and Wellness. I have not been involved in Hogan Court.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: I don’t want to go several rounds with the minister on this, but according to the AG’s report, the Department of Public Works did play a role, which means the minister’s department played a role. Again, to quote the AG report on Hogan Court, “Public Works played a supporting role, providing feedback on building quality and the reasonability of the construction budget based on the assumption that limited renovations were needed. Public Works was responsible for the conversion of the property until May 2023, when the project was transferred to Build Nova Scotia as part of their Healthcare Infrastructure Division.”

 

Why was the MOU signed with the developer and not the actual property owner? Where did the decision originate? I guess I’ll add this question: Within the MOU was a statement from the developer that the property was 90 per cent complete. Why was the assertion not independently confirmed before the purchase?

 

KIM MASLAND: I don’t really want to go back and forth either, but this is a health question. We, the Department of Public Works, did not purchase the property. It was the Department of Health and Wellness, and the DPW did not sign the MOU.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: Continuing with Hogan Court, in regard to what the AG has said in the report, the Department of Public Works was tasked with preparing a cost estimate for leasing the property. However, the NSHA relied on a consultant to estimate the cost of purchasing. Why wasn’t this done in-house?

 

KIM MASLAND: Again, thank you, but we were not involved with the purchase of Hogan Court, so I don’t know why it wasn’t done in-house or why it wasn’t done somewhere else. I was not involved with the purchase of Hogan Court.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: To the minister, there now seems to be some confusion here. I’m just wondering why the AG is citing the Department of Public Works as playing “a supporting role, providing feedback on building quality and the reasonability of the construction budget based on the assumption limited renovations were needed. Public Works was responsible for the conversion of the property until May 2023, when the project was transferred to Build Nova Scotia as part of their Healthcare Infrastructure Division.” Could the minister please explain to me why the AG is stating this if the Department of Public Works had nothing to do with Hogan Court?

 

KIM MASLAND: Public Works was involved on a technical side, so we offered information on the renovation of Hogan Court only on a technical side. Again, we were not involved - Public Works was not involved in the purchase of Hogan Court. That was the Department of Health and Wellness.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: I want to thank the minister for clarifying the responsibility of the Department of Public Works with regards to Hogan Court. I want to thank her for that, and I’ll move along, because I don’t think I’m going to get any more answers from that.

 

My understanding with regards to appointments to the Build Nova Scotia Advisory Board comes through the Department of Public Works. I wonder if the minister can tell me why there have been no appointments to the Build Nova Scotia Advisory Board nearly 16 months after it was created. How are the decisions being made in its absence?

 

[6:30 p.m.]

 

KIM MASLAND: I am sure the member can appreciate that this was a huge transition. We had to bring in Nova Scotia Lands, Develop Nova Scotia, and then we had Nova Scotia Lands Healthcare Infrastructure Division. We brought everyone in together. We had an interim CEO and then we had a new CEO appointed to Build Nova Scotia. We have been working through the structure and the organization of that. The board - there are members whom we expect will be appointed through the ABC process, like any other board would. We expect those appointments to be made this Spring.

 

The member should know that this is an advisory board, not a governing board. This is a board to give advice but certainly it is not binding. Again, an advisory board, not a governing board. The decisions that have been made since we’ve come together are with the CEO and our deputy minister.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: The minister may have said it but I just didn’t hear it. Excuse me if it was already said, but is there a current timeline for getting the board in place?

 

KIM MASLAND: Yes, I did indicate that we are looking at the Spring.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: I thank the minister for repeating it. I just wasn’t sure if I caught it. The minister is responsible for Build Nova Scotia, was my understanding, under the Act, but it was announced in October 2022 that the ministerial oversight would be shared with the Minister of Service Nova Scotia. Now that the Minister of Health and Wellness has assumed responsibility for health care development, does the oversight of Build Nova Scotia still fall with the Minister of Public Works or fall under the Minister of Health and Wellness? Also, if it falls under the Minister of Health and Wellness, what is the role the Department of Public Works will be playing in the redevelopment projects such as the Halifax Infirmary?

 

KIM MASLAND: The redevelopment projects that are within Build Nova Scotia are the responsibility of the Minister of Health and Wellness and I am responsible for the rest that is under Build Nova Scotia. The Minister of Health and Wellness is solely responsible for the health care redevelopment projects.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: I want to thank the Chair and thank the minister for that clarification of responsibilities. With all the changes, it has been getting kind of confusing.

 

I want to talk a little bit about schools. The government has committed to building and repairing schools and adding modular classrooms. I’m wondering if the minister can speak a bit on how locations are selected for new builds and repairs, and what were the main criteria for selecting one area over another.

 

KIM MASLAND: School site selections are done through the Department of Education and Early Childhood Development. The Department of Education and Early Childhood Development would reach out to us with potential sites, and where we become involved is we would look at site line direction, the amount of traffic that would be able to be handled through the area, and we would do some geotechnical work on the land that was there, but the actual school site selections are done through the Department of Education and Early Childhood Development.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: I’m just wondering if the minister can answer this: Are there plans to expand the schools that are currently using modulars or portables to ensure that children and staff feel like they are actually a part of the school, rather than removed from the school by being in modulars and portables? This is often an issue I hear about, not just in my own constituency but around the province, talking to teachers and talking to parents where children, when they’re in the modulars and the portables, they actually don’t really feel like they’re part of the school, because they’re outside of the actual physical school. I’m just wondering: Are there any plans to expand the schools, or to create - I know in my riding we used to have the little school and the big school kind of system, and I’m just wondering, are there any plans?

 

KIM MASLAND: Again, that is an EECD decision, if they’re building modulars or building schools. Public Works is the builder of government, so if Education and Early Childhood Development comes to us and says they want this built, we can build it, but we certainly don’t make that decision. That is strictly Education and Early Childhood Development.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: I’m going to turn some attention for the last little bit on some provincial parks and trail maintenance. Smileys Provincial Park experienced extreme flooding last Summer, and this caused significant damage. Some of the trails have been reopened, but the extent of the damage has not been fully established yet. Is the department going to direct resources to this park to ensure that it is ready for Summer use, and is there a timeline in place to get to a full reopening?

 

KIM MASLAND: I feel bad here because I can’t give you the answers that you are looking for, because they’re not in my department. That parks question - trail questions like that - should be to the Department of Natural Resources and Renewables or the Department of Communities, Culture, Tourism and Heritage.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: All right. With the last remaining time, let’s talk some highways. The government is budgeting $500 million for highways for 2024-25. What criteria are being used to decide which highway projects to fund with the budgeted amount?

 

KIM MASLAND: I can answer this question. It’s a huge question, though.

 

Decisions about major construction and twinning of the 100-Series highways are based on - you probably heard me talk about it earlier - traffic volumes, safety studies, and collision statistics. We also look at paving projects that are based on pavement age, pavement condition, and traffic volumes. Of course, our chief engineer works with our local district offices to look at district priorities, and then they would be reviewed and become part of the overall provincial plan.

 

This was interesting: I got to go to Miller Lake to view this piece of equipment. We have what is called an automatic road analyzer - ARAN - and it is to measure the smoothness, rutting, and cracks in the asphalt surface of a selected road. The strength of the selected road is also measured. This data is used by a peer review group to discuss the rehabilitation methods and the best way to approach the addressed noted deficiencies. This vehicle - you may see it - travels around our province. It has a scanning device underneath to measure the smoothness and the ruts. Then it brings back that data, which is part of the peer review group.

 

Our district directors and maintenance supervisors - the men and women who are out there in the field, travelling our roads within their districts - are also seeing deficiencies and what needs to be done. It all comes back to the chief engineer, who forms the overall provincial plan.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: Is the department tracking whether or how population increases are impacting our highways?

 

KIM MASLAND: Certainly. A lot of the statistics would be collected through our ARAN vehicle. It is looking at the stress on the roads and the ruts. We don’t track the weather. We know - over the past, especially in July - the flooding and the storms we experienced there and the damage that was done, trucking does most of the damage to our roads. With increased trucks to the port, you can see damage. We know the importance of our truckers, so we continue to work through that. We don’t track weather, but our ARAN vehicle would certainly give us that data.

 

You heard me talk earlier today about the increased traffic and our population growth. We look at Highway No. 103: 10,000 vehicles on that road now. Highway Nos. 104 and 102, with the demands on our roads with the increased population growth and traffic - we certainly see that. That’s why we’re investing in our 100-Series highways.

 

KENDRA COOMBES: I’m sorry. I meant “whether” as in w-h-e-t-h-e-r not w-e - I think I should have been a bit clearer on that.

 

As you were talking, saying, “we don’t track the weather,” I realized I probably should have clarified what I was talking about. With the amount of time I have left, I do want to go back to a question on bridges. Our party has been meeting with the Department of Public Works year after year about the Harris Street bridge over Highway No. 111. It’s inaccessible and cannot be cleared of snow in Winter, and is deteriorating.

 

Is the minister looking into replacing the structure?

 

[6:45 p.m.]

 

KIM MASLAND: I’m assuming the member’s talking about Portland Street?

 

KENDRA COOMBES: I believe I’ve talking about the Harris Street bridge.

 

If the minister can’t get me a response on Harris, I will take a response on the Portland Street overpass, though.

 

KIM MASLAND: For Portland Street, we have no immediate plans to replace the structure. We do continue to work with the municipality. It’s their AT project. It’s still in the concept phase.

 

HRM is actually exploring a stand-alone pedestrian crossing. We’ll continue to work with the municipality as the approaches do not . . .

 

THE CHAIR: Order. The time allotted for the NDP caucus has expired. We will now move on to the Liberal caucus with a note that the time will expire at 7:43 p.m.

 

The honourable member for Timberlea-Prospect.

 

HON. IAIN RANKIN: I only have probably 10 or 15 minutes on predominantly, I think, all of the local questions in our caucus. Definitely, I think we’ll have some time to let you do your resolution before that hour is completed.

 

First of all, thank you to the staff, especially over the last year. I know it’s been a tough year dealing with so many different issues in Public Works - the flooding, the snow, all of the different issues, especially with all those extreme events. It’s certainly a lot to deal with. My predecessor, Bill Estabrooks, said it’s the best department to manage - and your predecessor in the department. Certainly, I could appreciate that. I’ve dealt with a lot of area managers and senior staff over the last 10 years, and it’s been a great experience, second to none, dealing with other departments.

 

First off, my riding, especially, is a mix of urban and rural, but Prospect Road is really the concentration of where the rural residents are. It’s a provincial road. It’s the main road into all of the Prospect Road communities. I have Highway No. 103 too. Since the Hubley-Tantallon areas have been transferred over to HRM, I’ve been really focused singularly on the Prospect Road communities.

 

I’ve asked the minister about the scope and about the traffic study of Prospect Road. I know the minister understands the importance behind it, both from the existing pressure points along that road and the future projections with commercial, industrial, and residential - virtually all sectors’ projected growth. The answer from the minister just the other day was that the scope has been finalized for the traffic study and the tender will be out in a couple of weeks.

 

I’m just wondering what the minister could share in terms of what that scope is

and an estimated time frame to conduct the study to receive those recommendations or the findings from the study that will look at the access points within the Prospect Road communities on what is also known as Highway No. 333.

 

KIM MASLAND: I appreciate the member’s question. We had a chance to talk a little bit about it in Question Period the other day. Yes, the traffic study is under way. The scope - some of the things that will be included in the traffic study are looking at an alternate route to Highway No. 103, looking at that traffic congestion, turning movements at the intersection, how it affects traffic. We also look at obviously the traffic count there. We know that there is a large - the traffic count with Exhibition Park, and of course, the residential development and business development. We’re seeing increased demands on that road, so we look at the traffic volumes.

 

Also looking at the future growth there as well, and what we need to do to meet that demand. We have seen, as I mentioned in Question Period the other day - I remember going there 30 years ago and certainly didn’t see the traffic that I see now when I go to visit my friends. All of that will be encompassed. It’s a broad scope, and I’m really looking forward to this. I want you to know that we understand, at the department, the issues on that road - the collisions, the traffic congestion - and we are certainly going to work with you through this project.

IAIN RANKIN: Really, that is the main concern for me for the area - that study and what comes out of it. Like the minister, I don’t really want to presuppose what comes out of it and advocate for a specific way of dealing with it. That’s what I’ve said to residents: Let’s see what the evidence says. It is a choke point and I think it’s going to be very difficult to actually figure out if it is an alternate route, where that goes. The motor vehicle accidents happen throughout the road, so it’s a huge challenge, but I’m willing to support the department with what comes out of the findings of that.

 

We have had, I think, no fewer than six or seven intersection improvements over the last 10 years on Prospect Road - huge improvements - and that’s a testament to the staff who do have a good understanding, whether it’s the deputy minister himself who has worked in the region years ago, Mark Peachey, Guy Deveau, and Don Maillet. There are lots of them who know the area, which is helpful.

 

I would just say that whenever we do get work, which is a process, this is just the start. Eventually you have to secure the capital and the plan. I understand that as much as anybody. Whenever there is work that is approved in the future that we look to a similar implementation as when we rebuilt the Highway No. 102/Highway No. 103 overpass, because there is so much traffic that we were able to build that structure at the same time as having something open the whole time. That’s a consideration I just want to convey.

 

On that same theme, looking at way down the road - I know the minister knows this, because she visited the site - is the bridge down in Blind Bay. I know the tender had closed March 15^th that will rebuild the culvert for the area. I was really thankful that the department stepped up to put the Bailey bridge in. We do have that traffic flow that’s continuing now, which is good.

 

Since the tender just recently closed, I’d just ask the question: How will the hours of operation impact the traffic flow now that that tender is closed? Do we anticipate another closure, or is there still going to be traffic flow? I think that’s a really important question for residents, especially in the Dover areas, and the businesses down there. Anything you can share about start date, duration, work schedule? I completely understand if that specific information isn’t available readily at hand right now. I think the main question is whether or not the road will be closed down during that time, and if there is any info to share - a start date, especially - on that project.

 

KIM MASLAND: Yes. This was one of the first sites that I visited. I was actually visiting with my friend, and the night of the storm I opened up Highway No. 104, and on the way back I was heading back to Liverpool, and the rain just got so bad that I called my friend and said, “Can I come stay with you?” So one of the first sites that the chief engineer and I visited early in the morning was the Blind Bay bridge.

 

We hope to have this site work completed by August 16^th. There will not be closures. The construction will be done beside the Bailey, and the traffic will just be flipped. I realize that the Summer season is going to be very difficult with the increased traffic going down through Peggy’s Cove, but certainly we’ll try to flip that traffic and work through it the best we can.

 

IAIN RANKIN: I appreciate the answer very much. Since we’re talking about that specific region of the Dovers, there is a small local road I have to ask about. It’s called the Whistlers Cove Road. The department has it in the five-year plan for this coming paving season for a double chip seal. There have been questions asked about drainage. I’m really happy that we’re finally able to get this road dealt with. It’s relatively low-traffic. I agree with the assessment the department has made, but residents are asking a specific question of if they’ll raise the road up. I don’t know if you can answer that, but is there anything in terms of the scope of the project that could be shared, if it’s possible to raise the road up for the drainage issues that they’ve had over time? There are concerns around snow removal, plowing, and having a turnaround section at the end.

 

I realize there aren’t a whole lot of residents who live down there, but there have been consistent routine issues with the road. Again, I’m happy the Whistlers Cove Road - it’s a side road down in the Dover areas. Is there anything that can be shared - if they’ll raise the road up and if it can be - if the scope of the project can be shared with the residents who live there, specifically?

 

[7:00 p.m.]

 

KIM MASLAND: We’ve got a good minister getting Whistlers Cove Road done. Boy oh boy, lucky. Right now, what we’re looking at is we would do ditching and obviously do the pipework for the drainage that would need to be done there, and then put some gravel down and chip it. There are no plans to raise the road, but certainly, if you want to get into more details, further details of the scope of the project, I would recommend setting up a meeting with our chief engineer. Hopefully you could communicate that to your constituents.

 

IAIN RANKIN: That’s a fair answer. I’ll do that. Question on the Prospect Road again. We’ve successfully been able to install the active transportation lanes, really a fairly large stretch from Goodwood into Hatchet Lake into Whites Lake. There’s a plan now into the next section this year. It’s a relatively small section. I would just ask the question: Can I get a commitment from the department - and I think the Chair would probably support me in this as well - to continue with the active transportation lanes all the way through to Peggy’s Cove and beyond, the whole Peggy’s Cove loop?

 

I know that’s a big ask, but the question really is if there can be a piece every year for the foreseeable future that the department is focused on, this really important route for tourism, for active transportation, for people who run, walk, and roll a stroller. I can tell you, every time I drive down Prospect Road or Peggys Cove Road on those paved sections, I see people walking or running, and it does make a difference. It’s not just a bike lane; it’s for the safety of the people driving in cars as well, so they don’t have to cross the centre line when people are actually on the side of the road. I think, again, that the Chair would probably agree with me that this project continues. I hope this can be seen as an official multi-year plan.

 

KIM MASLAND: I can certainly confirm that the Chair has spoken to me about that - very passionate about that - and I am also as minister very passionate about active transit in our province. I certainly cannot commit to you today, but it is our intention - I think it’s always been the intention to continue piece-by-piece as we continue down the road to Peggy’s Cove.

 

IAIN RANKIN: I’ll certainly bring it up every year when I have the chance. One question that’s not specific to paving - it’s more on the build side of things: There’s no longer a plan for the transitional building in Bayers Lake for health care. I just wonder what the plans are for the land adjacent to the Bayers Lake Community Outpatient Centre and if the department would consider looking at - I referenced this before in meetings in the past - another access point so that folks from the Beechville-Lakeside-Timberlea area can get right through from the industrial park area.

 

It is unbelievably close from the Beechville Industrial Park - it used to be called the Lakeside Industrial Park - to the Outpatient Centre. You can see it. It’s probably a 7-iron. I haven’t been playing much golf lately, maybe a pitching wedge for the deputy minister. I’m wondering if there’s another access point being considered or if there’s really anything else that the department is thinking about with that plan.

 

I’ve heard rumours from sources at HRM staff that there’s the potential for a soccer facility in the Bayers Lake area. I’ve heard potential for another hockey rink that people are looking for out in the Bayers Lake area. There are a lot of rumours floating around. I don’t know what kind of answer I’ll get on this, but there’s certainly a lot of interest for lands around Bayers Lake and recreation. I’m definitely always supportive of recreation opportunities there, but in this case, I just see it so close to that entrance of the industrial park, and I’m sure the deputy minister has heard the rumours where that industrial park would have been connected to the Bayers Lake Business Park at one point or another.

 

Sometimes it gets confused with different levels of government. HRM owns the industrial park. Do they want to connect with the Bayers Lake park? I don’t know. I see it as inevitable at some point in time in my lifetime, but I think if we start planning for getting more and more people to be able to access that way, rather than going through the very cumbersome way on Chain Lake Drive, I think that would be a good thing to consider at this point, if not committing to it. Maybe someone could look at the potential for that connecting node directly into that part of the Bayers Lake park that will see the growth in the next number of years.

 

KIM MASLAND: Presently, the land that is there is still being held for consideration by Health. There are no other discussions that are happening right now for that land, except looking at it for Health for their master Central Zone plan.

 

THE CHAIR: The honourable member for Northside-Westmount.

 

FRED TILLEY: Thank you, Minister and staff, for being here on the last day of Estimates - the last 35 minutes of Estimates. Saved the best for last, almost. I’ve got a couple more questions back here.

 

I’m going to jump right in. We talked about this last year during Estimates. One of the biggest bones of contention in my district - and I know it’s in a lot of districts - is the difference between the municipal and the provincial roads, especially when it comes to subdivisions and residential areas and the differences in standards.

 

You had mentioned last year that you were going to talk to CBRM. I’m just wondering if there has been any discussion about transfer of provincial residential areas over to the municipality.

 

HON. KIM MASLAND: I personally have not had any conversations with CBRM. I know that the topic or the conversation of provincial roads being taken over by municipalities was discussed with the service exchange, and it was not accepted. But certainly, I can tell you that as Minister of Public Works, I will always have the conversation. If there is a municipal unit that’s looking to take over a provincial road, certainly I am willing.

 

I would suggest that if that is the case, you have someone from CBRM reach out to me and we can have the conversation.

 

FRED TILLEY: Maybe it’s - just to clarify, it wasn’t accepted by the municipalities? Maybe it’s time for the residents to start putting the pressure on the municipalities to have that conversation as well. A lot of the calls that we get - you probably have provincial road subdivisions in your area. When they’re 24-hour level of service versus the 10- or 12-hour level of service for snow removal, and the taxes and the repair and all of those different services cause a lot of grief for residents. I will have a conversation with CBRM as well and try and move that forward.

 

The next question I have is around provincial signage. I noticed not just in my riding but in a lot of ridings, a lot of the signs are starting to deteriorate, especially the blue tourism ones. They get faded, they get cracked. I’m wondering if there’s an emphasis going to be put on that this Spring and Summer to replace some of those signs and if there’s an increase in budget.

 

KIM MASLAND: Signage: one of my favourite things to talk about. I look up at some of the DPW staff right now shaking their heads because one of the things that drives me absolutely nuts is seeing a dilapidated sign along our road network. I will say that the blue signs, although they are along our road network, were put in by the Department of Communities, Culture, Tourism and Heritage. I think that would be a Department of Communities, Culture, Tourism and Heritage issue. I don’t know if they would be interested in replacing those or not.

 

I can assure you that the direction has been given to DPW for all district directors, and I know it has been done. They have gone out to each of their districts. I have asked them to do a complete inventory of their signs. I have asked them to drive their entire district and tell me what signs need to be replaced and to make sure that they start replacing them.

 

FRED TILLEY: That’s good news, and I will talk to the Minister of Communities, Culture, Tourism and Heritage as well, because that’s the first impression that a lot of tourists see, so we should either replace them or take them down. When you come off the Newfoundland ferry, you’re coming from province to province and it’s not good.

 

The next part is kind of related to signage but also towards the medians. I noticed that this year we were really late in doing the mowing around the medians and around the signage, so there’s a lot of brush growing up around the signs. First of all, how is that allocated? Is it contractors who do the mowing across the province? I have heard that there’s only one mower for all of Cape Breton. Is there a plan to increase the level of mowing? Someone suggested to me to bring back the Summer student program to help with the signage and mowing. I’m just wondering if there’s any plans to get that a little quicker this year.

 

KIM MASLAND: Another thing that really drives me crazy - certainly, the intent this year is to make sure that we’re out there as early as we can, weather permitting, to get that mowing done. We have internal and contractors that do the mowing. Many times, internally, it is to get the signage, because we have to have proper signage to go out and do the work. For me, I take great pride in the work that the department does. I take great pride in our 100-Series highways, our roads. You know what? It’s little things like mowing that, when people enter our province and drive our highways - I’ve always said that if you can paint a yellow line - I’ve heard people say, oh my gosh, we got a new road, because we painted the yellow line. It’s little things like that. Maybe it’s the female minister in me, I don’t know. I like things looking good. Once again, the Department of Public Works staff up there are looking at me knowing that that direction has already been given.

 

FRED TILLEY: You’re right, minister: You only get one chance to make a first impression. When things don’t look tidy on the roads, then automatically you go to the negative. It’s one positive.

 

One other thing I wanted to mention is in Cape Breton on Highway No. 125. I’m getting a lot of calls about the rutting from North Sydney to Sydney. It’s an ongoing problem, and I don’t know if it has to do with the quality of the asphalt or if it’s the bed underneath. There’s a lot of truck traffic on those roads, which causes a lot of it. I know that for sure. It’s very dangerous, and there have been a lot of accidents. It causes a lot of hydroplaning in that area. I’m just wondering if there are any plans to redo the rutting on Highway No. 125 this Summer.

 

KIM MASLAND: Certainly, rutting on our 100-Series highways - we’re seeing a lot of that too from truck traffic. We know how dangerous that can be. This section of road is on for micro-surfacing, but it’s two years out, which certainly would take care of those ruts. What I will commit to is I will have someone from the district go down and take a look. If there’s some way we can do some filling in those ruts until funding becomes available - but the micro-surfacing will be done in two years. I realize that’s a long time to wait, especially when you have ruts like that. I will have someone from the district go down and take a look. If there’s something we can do in the meantime to try to make it safer, certainly we will do that.

 

[7:15 p.m.]

 

FRED TILLEY: That’s wonderful because it is - and when they come down, if they need me, just give me a call or whatever because I get a ton of calls on that. I’m sure some of the other Cape Bretoners might as well. It’s quite dangerous there, so thank you.

 

I’m going to turn some time over to my colleague for Halifax Armdale. We are going to leave you time to do your resolutions.

 

THE CHAIR: The honourable member for Halifax Armdale.

 

ALI DUALE: Thank you to the staff. I just have a quick question. I do have a letter here that I received from your office. I sent a letter to the Premier with your office requesting a speed limit change through my constituency. Usually, I don’t like to mention my disappointment, but I really am disappointed in the response to my request. I’m going to take this opportunity for the public record. I’m wondering what it takes to make a decision to change the speed limit of Dunbrack, specifically the portion of the provincial jurisdiction. We know the population is growing. We have Long Lake beside this road. We have a new subdivision coming within the constituency. There are a lot of people, a lot of children within that area, and I do have a concern. Also, we do have - members of the constituency have raised concerns about a speed chase in the nighttime. Could I have an answer: What does it take to change this speed limit?

 

KIM MASLAND: My apologies that I have disappointed the member. Sadly, I disappoint people all the time, it seems like.

 

A couple of things: A traffic study would be done by our provincial traffic authority. They look at multiple things. They do a radar count, which would determine if it would warrant a speed reduction. They would look at the speed of the traffic. They would look at what’s happening on the side of the road, such as if there are more driveways there now than what was there when the speed limit was set. They look at intersections. They would use all of that to determine what a safe running speed is for traffic.

 

I think a traffic study has been done. Is that correct? No? Okay. What I’ll commit to you is that I will make sure a traffic study is done. I hear since becoming the minister - and I hear it in my own constituency all the time - it’s about speed. Everyone is driving so fast, not only our highways but on our local roads, trunks, and routes. It’s ridiculous, the speed that people are driving right now.

 

The speed chase you speak about is an enforcement issue. It wouldn’t matter if I set the speed limit to 50 kilometres per hour; they’re probably still going to do a speed chase. That is a huge enforcement issue. We have a provincial traffic authority for a reason. They base their decisions on a lot of things, many that I’ve outlined for you. I will certainly have them go out and look at an in-depth traffic study on that section you’re talking about.

 

ALI DUALE: Quite honestly, I know for a fact that change doesn’t happen overnight. I’m aware there are procedures and policies that need to be followed, but I would really like to have your attention, because when this highway was built, this area was woods. There was no community. There were no subdivisions. Also, we didn’t have the lifestyle we have today. Most of the people moved back to benefit in terms of a recreation perspective: going for a walk, the lake, what have you. Because of that, I think the footprint of the area has increased. This has become a safety concern for my constituents. I thank you for your response, and I look forward to this issue being raised within your capacity.

 

I would like to give a few minutes to my colleague.

 

THE CHAIR: The honourable member for Cole Harbour-Dartmouth.

 

LORELEI NICOLL: Speaking of speeding, I know your deputy minister does know our meetings that we had in that regard. I know where he lives and what his speed limit is on his street. I wanted to ask - I know there was an announcement made to twin the Forest Hills Extension. I know the bottleneck that is the intersection of Main Street and the Forest Hills Extension is going to continue to be problematic and wondered if that intersection was part of that project and that design.

 

KIM MASLAND: We have committed the next phase of Highway No. 107. I talked about it earlier, in my opening remarks. We’re going to be doing some bridge work out there this Summer. Eventually, the plan would be for the traffic to bypass Main Street and connect out East Preston way. It will take some time. Everything takes time these days - and money. We are committed to that next phase of Highway No. 107 now.

 

LORELEI NICOLL: I knew you had a good answer - the way you sprung up that time. In that regard, I’m going to switch, because I know where a lot of our streets and those areas are over their design capacity. Portland Street has been, and HRM has the plan to do bus rapid transit along Portland Street and Cole Harbour Road. That’s going to remove a lane from Portland Street and Cole Harbour Road. I was wondering where the Mount Hope connector from Caldwell Road - it was a plan from way back in 2006, crossing DND lands - I just wondered if that was still part of the plan to help alleviate some of the pressure that Portland Street is experiencing.

 

KIM MASLAND: There have been no discussions that I’m aware of. What I can tell you is that the amazing work of our JRTA, which I know you are very supportive of, is testing that connection as part of their regional plan.

 

[7:30 p.m.]

 

LORELEI NICOLL: I’m crossing all my t’s and dotting all my i’s. With regards to enforcement, we know that there are signs posted along a lot of the highways for litter fines and the particular ramp that comes off of the circumferential onto Woodland Avenue is constantly full of litter. I just wondered, do we actually have enforcement of those litter fines, rather than having your maintenance people continually pick up the repeated dumping of litter outside their windows?

 

KIM MASLAND: This is an enforcement issue. We post the signs, and we hope that people will abide by them. You heard me talk about signs earlier, and you heard me talk about mowing, and how those two things are so important. Littering is another thing where I just cannot wrap my head around why people behave like this. We put out a video that we shared with the department and across Nova Scotia, talking about littering and the fines that are there. It is an enforcement issue. I don’t know how many tickets the RCMP or local law enforcement have done, but certainly we could try to find out for you. It’s a huge issue - again, another enforcement issue.

 

LORELEI NICOLL: I wasn’t aware that it was the RCMP that was doing litter fines, but anyway, thank you for those responses. I’m going to pass it on now to my colleague for Clayton Park West.

 

THE CHAIR: The honourable member for Clayton Park West.

 

RAFAH DICOSTANZO: I’m sure the minister is saying, Oh no, not her again. She knows the question.

 

If I may, I’d love to know about the negotiation process and how long it takes, because HRM has voted “yes” for the land. The survey was done last Summer, so from the Summer to now is six to nine months of negotiation. How does negotiation work between HRM and the province, and when will that end? When will we hear? If I could get some details on that.

 

KIM MASLAND: I know this has taken a long time. It has certainly been a process. My understanding is that we’re waiting on the signed agreement from HRM. It has taken a lot just to try to get the land to start with. They had to go through a council vote, which you’re aware of. Appraisal has been done, and we’re waiting on the official signed agreement.

 

RAFAH DICOSTANZO: My understanding is that they are waiting on the Province. As I said in Question Period, I have asked my councillor, and that is the information I received from my councillor in writing - that they are waiting on the Province. Somebody is telling me one thing, and the other person is telling me - what I would love to know is how much money in this year’s budget has been allocated. What is the next phase? Let’s say HRM gives you what you are looking for, and we start. What is the next stage? How much money will you be spending, and is that in the budget for this year?

 

KIM MASLAND: This year, we have $7.5 million budgeted for design.

 

RAFAH DICOSTANZO: I am hopeful - I am trying my best to get the two, but we are so in need of this school. I would really appreciate your help.

 

I don’t know how much time the minister needs, but my colleague would like whatever minutes you have. How much time do you need? Two minutes? Whatever time is for my colleague.

 

THE CHAIR: The honourable member for Cumberland North.

 

ELIZABETH SMITH-MCCROSSIN: If it is possible, maybe I could put down my questions in a letter and send it through that. It might make it easier. If the minister had an opportunity, there are two high-priority items. One, of course, is Highway No. 366. It was shut down this afternoon. The road is closed. I am wondering if the minister can say: Will that be considered an emergency to make sure that a permit is received right away, given the fact that it is an evacuation route and is such an important piece of highway for the province?

 

The second item is Howard Bridge. I don’t know if there would be time to give a quick update on that, the reason for the delays, and if there is a timeline for when that would be prepared.

 

KIM MASLAND: Very quickly, I’m probably going to have to give a Howard Bridge update in writing. I understand the importance of Highway No. 366 and what’s going on there. We have the roads - the gravel road is actually drying out a little bit, so we have some wind and high sun. We understand the importance of this, and certainly we’ll get in there and try to do whatever we can as soon as we can, okay?

 

THE CHAIR: I see no more questions.

 

The honourable Minister of Public Works, to make her closing statements.

 

HON. KIM MASLAND: Thank you to that amazing team up there in the gallery. I so appreciate all of your support today. To the deputy and to Brent, thank you. To all the other amazing Public Works employees out there, thank you for everything you do. I know my kids are watching. They told me to be kind and to be nice today, so hopefully I was kind and nice. I don’t know why they think I’m not, but anyway, with those few closing words:

 

Resolution E36 - Resolved that a sum not exceeding $716,170,000 be granted to the Lieutenant Governor to defray expenses in respect of the Department of Public Works, pursuant to the Estimate.

 

THE CHAIR: Shall Resolution E36 stand?

 

Resolution E36 stands.

 

That concludes the consideration of Estimates.

 

We shall take just a few minutes’ recess.

 

[The committee recessed at 7:42 p.m.]

 

[7:57 p.m. The committee reconvened.]

 

THE CHAIR: Order. The time allotted for considerations of Supply today has elapsed.

 

The honourable member for Shelburne, Chair of the Subcommittee on Supply.

 

NOLAN YOUNG: I am pleased to report that the Subcommittee on Supply has met for the time allotted to it and considered various Estimates assigned to it.

 

THE CHAIR: Shall all the remaining resolutions carry?

 

The resolutions are carried.

 

The honourable Government House Leader.

 

KIM MASLAND: I move the committee of the Whole on Supply do rise and report these Estimates.

 

THE CHAIR: The motion is carried.

 

The committee will now rise and report these Estimates to the House. Please give us a few minutes to get our things in order.

 

[The committee adjourned at 7:58 p.m.]