Assemblée Législative de la Nouvelle-Écosse

Les travaux de la Chambre ont repris le
21 septembre 2017

Hansard -- Mon., Nov. 30, 1998

First Session

MONDAY, NOVEMBER 30, 1998

TABLE OF CONTENTS PAGE
PRESENTING AND READING PETITIONS:
Transport. & Pub. Wks. - Hwy. No. 7: Tangier - Speed Limit Reduce,
Hon. K. Colwell 4621
Agric.: Black Rock - Hog Operation, Mr. G. Archibald 4622
PRESENTING REPORTS OF COMMITTEES:
Law Amendments Committee, Hon. Manning MacDonald 4622
Law Amendments Committee, Hon. Manning MacDonald 4622
TABLING REPORTS, REGULATIONS AND OTHER PAPERS:
Report of the Commission of Inquiry on Remuneration of Elected
Provincial Officials, Mr. Speaker (by Hon. Manning MacDonald) 4623
STATEMENTS BY MINISTERS:
Lbr. - WCB: Premiums Stabilization - Payment, Hon. R. MacKinnon 4623
Educ. - Re/Visioning: Canadian Perspectives on the Education of
Africans in the Late 20th Century, Hon. R. Harrison 4625
NOTICES OF MOTION:
Res. 2203, Educ. - Student Loans: Chartered Bank Control -
Reconsider, Mr. R. Chisholm 4628
Res. 2204, Agric. - Farmers: Pork - Loans Provide, Mr. G. Archibald 4628
Res. 2205, Health - Maclean Hunter Practice Excellence Award:
Dr. Anita Foley (Guys.) - Congrats., Mr. R. White 4629
Vote - Affirmative 4630
Res. 2206, Educ. - John Templeton Fdn. Competition: Nicola Parker
(Bras d'Or-UCCB) - Winner Congrats., Ms. Helen MacDonald 4630
Vote - Affirmative 4630
Res. 2207, Agric. - Farmers: Pork - Fin. Package Construct,
Mr. B. Taylor 4631,
Res. 2208, Educ. - Youth for Youth Workshop (Anna. Royal):
Participants - Commend, Mr. L. Montgomery 4631
Vote - Affirmative 4632
Res. 2209, Sports - Canada Games N.S. Hockey (Female):
Lindsay Taylor (Dart.) - Selection Congrats., Ms. Y. Atwell 4632
Vote - Affirmative 4633
Res. 2210, Nat. Res. - Nat. Gas: Plan (All-Party) - Create,
Dr. J. Hamm 4633
Res. 2211, Fish. - Lobster: Harvest - Support, Hon. K. Colwell 4633
Vote - Affirmative 4634
Res. 2212, Dartmouth Boys & Girls Club: Anniv. 35th - Congrats.,
Mr. D. Chard 4634
Vote - Affirmative 4635
Res. 2213, Health - Caregivers: Sacrifice - Recognize, Mr. G. Moody 4635
Res. 2214, Educ. - Richmond Co. Literacy Soc.: Offices New -
Congrats., Mr. M. Samson 4636
Vote - Affirmative 4636
Res. 2215, Young Lib. Assoc. (Sydney) - Comments (Premier):
Declaration (Economy [N.S.]) - Inclusion Direct, Mr. F. Corbett 4636
Res. 2216, Health - Min.: Full Time - Appoint, Mr. J. DeWolfe 4637
Res. 2217, Justice - Operation Red Nose: Dal. Univ. Swim Team -
Congrats., Mr. G. Fogarty 4637
Vote - Affirmative 4638
Res. 2218, Fish. - Groundfish: Dumping (Ecology Action Ctr. [N.S.] &
Conservation Council [N.B.]) Report - Action, Mr. John Deveau 4638
Res. 2219, Health - Physicians Recruitment: Claims Fictitious -
Acknowledge, Dr. J. Hamm 4639
Res. 2220, Sports - Tae Kwon Do: Adam Baxter (Middleton RHS) -
Success Congrats., Mr. L. Montgomery 4639
Vote - Affirmative 4640
Res. 2221, Educ. - Teachers: Christmas Concerts -
Commitment Thank, Mr. W. Estabrooks 4640
Vote - Affirmative 4641
Res. 2222, Tech. & Sc. Sec't. - Y2K: Testing Initiatives - Revisit,
Mr. G. Balser 4641
Res. 2223, NDP (N.S.) - Devco: Policy - Clarify,
Mr. Charles MacDonald 4642
Res. 2224, Fin. - Pub. Serv. Super'n. Plan: Actuarial Predictions -
Basis, Mr. H. Epstein 4642
Res. 2225, Health: Y2K Problem - Address, Mr. G. Moody 4643
Res. 2226, Commun. Serv. - Disabled Persons (Internat. Day
[Dec. 3rd]): Meaningful - Make, Mr. J. Pye 4643
Res. 2227, Fish. - Lobster: Importance - Acknowledge, Mr. N. LeBlanc 4644
Vote - Affirmative 4645
Res. 2228, Dartmouth-Cole Hbr. MLA - Hobby: Find - Recommend,
Mr. M. Samson 4645
Res. 2229, Econ. Dev. - Strategy: Co-op Dev. - Include, Mr. C. Parker 4646
Res. 2230, Educ. - Schools: Drug/Tobacco Reduction -
Programming Improve, Mr. J. Muir 4646
Res. 2231, Educ. - NSTU/Students: Angels for Honduras Project -
Congrats., Mr. John MacDonell 4647
Vote - Affirmative 4648
Res. 2232, Agric. - Ox Pulling: Neil Oickle (Lun. Co.) -
Commitment Congrats., Mr. M. Baker 4648
Vote - Affirmative 4648
Res. 2233, Educ. - Maritime Museum (Atl.): Anniv. 50th - Congrats.,
Mr. P. Delefes 4649
Vote - Affirmative 4649
Res. 2234, Econ. Dev. & Tourism - Anna Hope (Wolfville) &
Howard McKinley (Bedford): Prof. Dev. Prog. Accreditation -
Congrats., Mr. G. Balser 4649
Vote - Affirmative 4650
Res. 2235, Culture - Literature: Douglas Brown (C.B. [Children's Book,
The Magic Compass]) - Congrats., Ms. Helen MacDonald 4650
Vote - Affirmative 4651
Res. 2236, Educ. - Donald Sobey: Atl. Leadership Fund (Queens Univ.)-
Scholarships (Atl.) - Generosity Thank, Mr. J. DeWolfe 4651
Vote - Affirmative 4651
Res. 2237, Nat. Res. - St. Margaret's Bay Area: Rails-to-Trails Group -
Initiative Congrats., Mr. W. Estabrooks 4651
Vote - Affirmative 4652
Res. 2238, Human Res. - Affirmative Action Prog.: Failure
(Disabilities) - Acknowledge, Mr. G. Archibald 4652
Res. 2239, Culture - Music: Leslie Lake-Searle, Ross Thomson &
Rhapsody Quintet - CD Congrats., Mr. J. Muir 4653
Vote - Affirmative 4653
Res. 2240, Educ. - Mahone Bay School (Can. Trust Co. &
Legge's Storage Barn): Recycling Commitment - Congrats.,
Mr. M. Baker 4654
Vote - Affirmative 4654
Res. 2241, Culture - Bob Brooks (Photographer): Book (Yar. Co.) -
Congrats., Mr. N. LeBlanc 4654
Vote - Affirmative 4655
Res. 2242, Educ. - P3 Schools: Procurement Policy (Atl.) -
Compliance Support, Mr. B. Taylor 4655
INTRODUCTION OF BILLS:
No. 92, Applied Science Technology Act, Hon. C. Huskilson 4656
GOVERNMENT BUSINESS:
PUBLIC BILLS FOR THIRD READING:
No. 22, Health Research Foundation Act 4656
Mr. R. Chisholm 4656
Mr. John MacDonell 4657
Ms. Y. Atwell 4664
Mr. J. Holm 4666
Ms. Helen MacDonald 4672
Mr. F. Corbett 4674
Vote - Affirmative 4676
HOUSE RESOLVED INTO CWH ON BILLS AT 4:23 P.M. 4677
HOUSE RECONVENED AT 9:57 P.M. 4677
CWH REPORTS 4677
ADJOURNMENT, House rose to meet again on Tue., Dec. 1st at 12:00 p.m. 4678

[Page 4621]

HALIFAX, MONDAY, NOVEMBER 30, 1998

Fifty-seventh General Assembly

First Session

2:00 P.M.

SPEAKER

Hon. Ronald Russell

DEPUTY SPEAKER

Mr. Donald Chard

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please. We will commence the daily routine.

PRESENTING AND READING PETITIONS

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable Minister of Fisheries and Aquaculture.

HON. KEITH COLWELL: Mr. Speaker, I beg leave to table a petition which reads as follows:

"We, the undersigned, set forth this petition to be delivered to the Nova Scotia Department of Transportation & Public Works demanding, as taxpayers, that the speed limit on Highway #7 at Tangier, between the Spry Bay Garage and Residence #19939, be reduced from 90 kilometres/hour, to 80 kilometres/hour.".

Mr. Speaker, there are 27 names on the petition and I have also affixed my name to this petition.

MR. SPEAKER: The petition is tabled.

4621

[Page 4622]

The honourable member for Kings North.

MR. GEORGE ARCHIBALD: Mr. Speaker, I beg leave to table a petition regarding a hog operation at Black Rock from Laurie Arnburg and Alfred Dalton. I have affixed my signature to the petition as well.

MR. SPEAKER: The petition is tabled.

PRESENTING REPORTS OF COMMITTEES

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable Government House Leader.

HON. MANNING MACDONALD: Mr. Speaker, on behalf of the Chairman of the Committee on Law Amendments, I am directed to report that the committee has met and considered the following bills:

Bill No. 86 - Real Estate Appraisers Act.

Bill No. 89 - Medical Act.

and the committee recommends these bills to the favourable consideration of the House, each without amendment.

MR. SPEAKER: Ordered that this bill be referred to the Committee of the Whole House on Bills.

The honourable Government House Leader.

HON. MANNING MACDONALD: Mr. Speaker, on behalf of the Chairman of the Committee on Law Amendments, I am directed to report that the committee has met and considered the following bill:

Bill No. 83 - Motor Vehicle Act.

and the committee recommends this bill to the favourable consideration of the House, with certain amendments.

MR. SPEAKER: Ordered that this bill be referred to the Committee of the Whole House on Bills.

[Page 4623]

TABLING REPORTS, REGULATIONS AND OTHER PAPERS

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable Government House Leader.

HON. MANNING MACDONALD: On behalf of the Office of the Speaker, yourself, Mr. Speaker, I beg leave to table the House of Assembly Report on the Commission of Inquiry on Remuneration of Elected Provincial Officials.

MR. SPEAKER: The report is tabled.

STATEMENTS BY MINISTERS

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable Minister of Labour.

HON. RUSSELL MACKINNON: Mr. Speaker, before I start, I must apologize. I just received this. It is self-explanatory and I didn't get a chance to send a copy to my Opposition Critics but I will bear the criticism there.

Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to rise today to address my department's budget commitment pay-out, pleased because, again, it demonstrates this government's resolve to do the right thing despite financial restraints. The $13,307,000 highlighted in the table of expenditures, represents a payment made to the Workers' Compensation Board to stabilize the rates for employers and this helps with the cost of doing business in Nova Scotia. The negotiation was between the Province of Nova Scotia and the Workers' Compensation Board to assist the board in stabilizing the Workers' Compensation Board premiums.

The total amount agreed to, Mr. Speaker, to be paid to the Workers' Compensation Board was $23 million over five years. Payments were made in the 1995-96 fiscal year and again in the 1996-97 fiscal year. During the 1997-98 budget process, that payment was deferred to the year 2000-01. However, at the end of the 1997-98 fiscal year, because of a healthier financial position, the province was able to pay the balance of its obligation with a lump sum payment to the Workers' Compensation Board.

As I have said before, Mr. Speaker, and I will certainly say it again, this government is certainly not just about ideology, it is certainly about competence and doing the right thing. Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable member for Cape Breton Centre.

MR. FRANK CORBETT: Mr. Speaker, while I must applaud the members across the way for moving these monies forward, one has to realize that on one side they are patting themselves on the back and on the other one they are forgetting one large measure they did in their budget and that was remove a 1.25 per cent guarantee going toward the unfunded

[Page 4624]

liability which, in turn, over the 45 years of that unfunded liability trying to be paid down is a very onerous amount to be put on him. While it may sound like 1.5 per cent is not much, I can tell you, in being privy to some numbers, it has catastrophic effects. While they are howling from great heights and hard times what they are doing to help this board, yet they are not so loud in telling the people of Nova Scotia and, indeed, the members of the Workers' Compensation Board and the injured workers of the dangers they are doing to it.

So, if they want to be congratulated for the good, they must certainly be able to take it on the chin for the bad, and 1.25 per cent certainly is the bad. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. (Applause)

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable member for Lunenburg.

MR. MICHAEL BAKER: Mr. Speaker, I echo the comments of the member earlier lauding that, in fact, the payment has been made on the stabilization fund. However, I have two thoughts with respect to this matter.

The first is that it is clear that the Government of Nova Scotia has an obligation to the workers' compensation system in this province, an obligation to stabilize rates to employers, because there is no question that the rates charged to employers are a significant tax on employment in this province. Everyone during the work of the select committee recognized how difficult the problem of rates is in looking at the ability of our system in Nova Scotia to support the benefits that should be supported for injured workers.

Mr. Speaker, I think the government should, in the future, when looking at these commitments, establish commitments that are for defined periods of time and pay them on time, because there is a great inequality of bargaining power when the government is negotiating with the Workers' Compensation Board. I think that is something to remember for the future. There should be a program established of what the government is going to do for workers' compensation and then the government should be committed to those time-lines and do them on the time-lines and not negotiate with the board because I think that is a system fraught with difficulty.

The second comment, Mr. Speaker, is with respect to the rates and the guaranteed rate of return. That is a recommendation in the select committee's report and it is critical that the government look at that recommendation. Without implementing that recommendation, it will have a catastrophic effect on the ability of the Workers' Compensation Board to keep rates stable. I am sure the minister agrees with me on how important it is that the government keep rates stable.

[Page 4625]

So, Mr. Speaker, I would close by saying that while I certainly laud the government for making the payment to the WCB, I encourage the minister and his government to look at making sure that that 1.25 per cent guaranteed rate of return is reinstituted so that the payments in the province by employers remains stable. Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable Minister of Education.

HON. ROBERT HARRISON: Mr. Speaker, I rise today to table a copy of a very important book, a book that deserves a place in our Legislative Library.

The book is a recent publication entitled, Re/Visioning: Canadian Perspectives on the Education of Africans in the Late 20th Century. It contains original contributions by several African Nova Scotian writers and represents a tremendous accomplishment by the National Council of Black Educators of Canada. The book recognizes the contributions that African Nova Scotians have made in African Canadian education, and in making this book a reality.

A chapter is devoted to the 1994 BLAC Report on Education, prepared by the Nova Scotia Black Learners Advisory Committee, and the initiatives taken by government in partnership with African Nova Scotians to address the 46 recommendations contained therein. Another chapter focuses on Dalhousie University's experience with access programs for African Canadians.

Eight African Nova Scotians contributed to Re/Visioning, both as contributors and as members of the editorial committee. The following contributed articles to the book: Brad Barton, Past-Chair of the Council on African Canadian Education; George Elliot Clarke, poet, essayist and first recipient of the Portia White Prize; Sean Flynn Foyn, Magistral Student in History at the University of Ottawa; Patrick Kakembo, Assistant Director of African Canadian Services Division, Department of Education, Nova Scotia; and Robert Upshaw, Director, African Canadian Services Division, Department of Education.

The editorial committee included the following African Nova Scotians: Agnes Calliste, Saint Francis Xavier University; Wanda Thomas-Bernard, Dalhousie University; and the late Vanroy Tobitt, Principal of St. Patrick's-Alexandra School in Halifax. The strong representation of African Nova Scotians in this book reflects the leadership and the commitment of African Canadians in our province.

[2:15 p.m.]

Mr. Speaker, two years ago the Department of Education and Culture established the African Canadian Services Division. That division headed by Robert Upshaw has provided leadership in the initiatives described in Re/Visioning that are empowering African Nova Scotians. I will give you several examples. Sixteen supplementary education programs are operating in various communities across our province providing cultural and academic

[Page 4626]

enrichment to over 500 students. A pre-school program with Afrocentric curriculum has been established and is operating in North Preston with support to three existing programs, and two more pre-school sites are planned for January 1999. Twenty-four scholarships have been awarded to African Nova Scotians who have been accepted into teacher training institutions across the Province of Nova Scotia, the largest number of African Nova Scotians in teacher education in a single year ever.

A two year project to recover the Black Loyalist history from Birchtown, South Nova, Tracadie, Guysborough, is well underway through the Nova Scotia Museum and Canadian Heritage. Seven adult and family literacy programs are in operation along with other adult literary projects. African Canadian studies has been developed and implemented in 19 schools across Nova Scotia and a new African heritage literature course at the high school level is in the process of being developed.

Many groups continue to work in partnership with the Department of Education and Culture including the Black Cultural Centre, the Black Educators Association and the Council on African Canadian Educators, to name but a few. We continue to be committed to working with African Nova Scotian communities in promoting the rights and interests of African Nova Scotians. We are committed to ensuring that African Nova Scotian learners benefit from a fully supportive learning environment which recognizes the contributions that people of African descent have made and continue to make.

With these comments, Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to table Re/Visioning and ask that it be placed in our Legislative Library as a testament being made to the tremendous contribution of African Nova Scotians in Nova Scotia education. Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: The book is tabled.

The honourable member for Halifax Fairview.

MS. EILEEN O'CONNELL: Mr. Speaker, I rise to congratulate those who have put together this important book Re/Visioning: Canadian Perspectives on the Education of Africans in the Late 20th Century. It is clear from the minister's statement that the National Council of Black Educators of Canada has been enormously assisted by educators and those with the skills and knowledge from Nova Scotia. So certainly they are to be congratulated, both the Nova Scotian participants, writers and editors as well as the National Council of Black Educators.

Mr. Speaker, I think that the initiatives that the provincial government has undertaken in Black education and the samples that the minister gives here are useful in giving the range of them. I think that they are critically important to the development of, or the rediscovery of the culture of so many people who are part of this province. I just wanted to note, particularly, the absolute importance of the teacher training scholarships, for example, so that

[Page 4627]

Nova Scotians can learn in a classroom from people who have an understanding of their own history and their own traditions. I think it is a valuable contribution. I am sure that the Legislative Library will welcome having this book. I would also urge the minister, in whatever ways he can, to distribute it more widely and perhaps make it available not just to school libraries but to teachers and teacher in-service programs so that as many as possible can get the enrichment from this book. Thank you very much. (Applause)

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable member for Cumberland North.

MR. ERNEST FAGE: Mr. Speaker, it is a privilege to rise today and also add my words of congratulation to Re/Visioning, the authors and all the people who contributed to Re/Visioning and it to be added to the library here at the Legislature.

When we look at African Nova Scotian writers, the contribution to African writers across Canada and the Black cultural movement and the National Council of Black Educators, this is a wonderful testament to their culture. As Nova Scotians, we look at our rich history and we look at the rich history of African Nova Scotians, and we have to realize that they played a significant role in the foundation of this province and in the foundation of this country.

This book emphasizes part of the contribution, those cultures, these individuals listed below have made in that regard through time. It is very important to congratulate the people who have taken part in putting this vision together. It is very important to pause and take a look at some of the scholarships, some of the teaching aids, some of the benefits that the entire community are putting forward for the betterment of the citizens of that community.

Mr. Speaker, I would urge the government to ensure that the distribution of this book occur also in the technology age, because as the schools in the province, as learning institutions, as websites, as technology resource of literature and understanding move forward, this is the perfect opportunity to provide Re/Visioning to all Nova Scotians, so that we are indeed not only aware of the Black cultural heritage, the Nova Scotia African heritage being provided, that they have an opportunity to showcase their contribution. It is my pleasure to also recommend today that it be added to the library at the Legislature. Thank you.

GOVERNMENT NOTICES OF MOTION

NOTICES OF MOTION

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable Leader of the Opposition.

[Page 4628]

RESOLUTION NO. 2203

MR. ROBERT CHISHOLM: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas this Liberal Government put the banks in charge of student loans and let loan levels skyrocket; and

Whereas this Liberal Government told parents and students not to worry when the CIBC walked away from Nova Scotia's students, leaving the Royal Bank as the sole supplier; and

Whereas Liberal advice is still "don't worry", now that the Royal Bank wants the power to disqualify entire institutions and all their students from student loans;

Therefore be it resolved that the Minister of Education reconsider his government's decision to give a chartered bank control of student loans, which are an essential public service to increase access to education, and to ensure that student loans are available at all post-secondary institutions.

MR. SPEAKER: The notice is tabled.

The honourable member for Kings North.

RESOLUTION NO. 2204

MR. GEORGE ARCHIBALD: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas pork prices across the world are presently at their lowest level since the Depression years of the 1930's; and

Whereas Nova Scotia's hog industry is nearing a total state of collapse, unless the federal and provincial governments are able to put together a farm package that would assist producers during this severe economic downturn; and

Whereas additional funding provided under the Risk Management Program was simply not enough to stave off financial ruin for many hog producers who will be facing bankruptcy, unless a solution is reached very soon between Ottawa and Nova Scotia;

[Page 4629]

Therefore be it resolved that Nova Scotia's Minister of Agriculture and Marketing immediately see to it that Nova Scotia is provided with ample funding from Ottawa's farm-aid package, to provide loans for pork farmers to avert the loss of 1,500 jobs in Nova Scotia as well as the loss of $110 million annually in economic activity.

Mr. Speaker, I would ask for waiver of notice.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

I hear several Noes.

The notice is tabled.

The honourable member for Guysborough-Port Hawksbury.

RESOLUTION NO. 2205

MR. RAYMOND WHITE: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas the fourth annual Maclean Hunter Practice of Excellence Awards, recognizing that primary care physicians in Canada are second to none, were presented to four doctors, nominated from across Canada, at a reception in Toronto on November 20th; and

Whereas Dr. Anita Foley of Guysborough was honoured with the Award for Outstanding Care, recognizing her as a shining example of the rare breed of committed rural practitioners; and

Whereas the $1,000 charitable donation that comes with the award was donated by Dr. Foley to the Guysborough Food Bank and the Guysborough Hospital Foundation's Nurses Education Fund;

Therefore be it resolved that this House extend congratulations and best wishes to Dr. Foley on the receipt of this recognition of her outstanding service to her community and wish her continued success as she continues to serve her community.

Mr. Speaker, I request waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

[Page 4630]

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Cape Breton The Lakes.

RESOLUTION NO. 2206

MS. HELEN MACDONALD: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas the John Templeton Foundation recently sponsored an essay competition in religion and science; and

Whereas Nicola Parker, a resident of Bras d'Or and a graduate of the University College of Cape Breton, won this international essay competition, being chosen first out of 27 entries from seven countries; and

Whereas Ms. Parker developed her essay with the able help of Professor Robert Campbell, Chair of UCCB's Department of Social Science;

Therefore be it resolved that this House congratulate Ms. Parker and UCCB on her victory in the John Templeton Foundation competition.

Mr. Speaker, I request waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Colchester-Musquodoboit Valley.

[Page 4631]

RESOLUTION NO. 2207

MR. BROOKE TAYLOR: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas Nova Scotia pork producers are facing immediate bankruptcy as a consequence of global market forces following the route of the Asian economic crisis; and

Whereas 1,500 people are employed within Nova Scotia's hog industry, which generates $110 million annually in economic activity for the province; and

Whereas funding under the Risk Management Program was simply not enough to keep the industry from being on the verge of total collapse by early 1999;

Therefore be it resolved that since hog farmers are not looking for handouts, but instead a loan that is pork producer friendly, all members of the Nova Scotia Legislature encourage both Ottawa and Nova Scotia to continue negotiating and put together a financial package that will prevent Nova Scotia's hog industry from becoming extinct.

Mr. Speaker, I ask for waiver of notice.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

I hear a No.

The notice is tabled.

The honourable member for Annapolis.

RESOLUTION NO. 2208

MR. LAWRENCE MONTGOMERY: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas more than 60 high school students met in Annapolis Royal last month to explore social issues; and

Whereas this was the third annual Youth for Youth workshop which included students from Annapolis Royal, Bridgetown, Middleton and Digby; and

[Page 4632]

Whereas this program gives students an avenue to take leadership roles in issues affecting young people;

Therefore be it resolved that this House commend all the students who took part in this worthwhile exchange of ideas and wish them luck as they put this information to use in their own schools.

Mr. Speaker, I request waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Preston.

RESOLUTION NO. 2209

MS. YVONNE ATWELL: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas Lindsay Taylor of Dartmouth has been selected to the 1999 Nova Scotia Canada Games Female Hockey Team; and

Whereas Lindsay earned the right to represent Team Nova Scotia at the prestigious Canada Games by attending evaluating zone and summer camps over the past two years; and

Whereas Lindsay was the only female in all of metro selected to participate at the 1999 Canada Winter Games in Cornerbrook, Newfoundland, which runs from February 27th through to March 6th;

Therefore be it resolved that this House congratulate Lindsay Taylor for her hard work, demonstrated skills and perseverance in being selected to the final 20 players.

Mr. Speaker, I ask for waiver.

[Page 4633]

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable Leader of the Progressive Conservative Party.

RESOLUTION NO. 2210

DR. JOHN HAMM: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas the Canada-Nova Scotia Benefits Plan Decision Report called for development phase expenditures in Nova Scotia of 28 per cent for materials; and

Whereas the same report called for development phase employment to be 53 per cent Nova Scotian; and

Whereas the Canada-Nova Scotia Benefits third quarter report indicates that cumulative Nova Scotia material expenditures of only 19 per cent and cumulative Nova Scotia employment level of only 27 per cent;

Therefore be it resolved that the Premier acknowledge the price that Nova Scotians have paid for his government's failure to plan and that the Premier and the Leader of the Opposition agree to our recommendation to create a three-Party, all-encompassing plan for Nova Scotia's natural gas industry.

[2:30 p.m.]

MR. SPEAKER: The notice is tabled.

The honourable Minister of Fisheries.

RESOLUTION NO. 2211

HON. KEITH COLWELL: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

[Page 4634]

Whereas today is opening day for the province's most lucrative lobster fishery; and

Whereas this fishery is the cornerstone of Nova Scotia's $1 billion fishing industry; and

Whereas all Parties in this province will work together to ensure an accident-free start to the season and for a bountiful catch;

Therefore be it resolved that this Legislature fully support this year's lobster harvest and wish health, happiness and goodwill to our fellow Nova Scotians who rigorously and rightfully fish for our greatest natural resource.

Mr. Speaker, I would ask for waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Dartmouth South.

RESOLUTION NO. 2212

MR. DONALD CHARD: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas the Dartmouth Boys and Girls Club is celebrating 35 years of outstanding service to the community of Dartmouth; and

Whereas in those 35 years the club has welcomed more than 20,000 youth into its many programs and activities; and

Whereas the club's activities have enriched considerably the lives of many children and youth;

Therefore be it resolved that this House congratulate the Dartmouth Boys and Girls Club on its years of exemplary service to the community and wish it many more years of success.

[Page 4635]

Mr. Speaker, I request waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Kings West.

RESOLUTION NO. 2213

MR. GEORGE MOODY: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas a recent study revealed many rural Nova Scotian women are carrying the burden for caring for elderly or infirm family members living at home; and

Whereas the study reveals that 70 per cent of the women interviewed were the sole caregiver, creating immense difficulty for those pursuing careers outside of the home; and

Whereas many caregivers feel betrayed by a health care system that provides a maximum of eight hours a week of respite for family care providers and none for those who need time to earn a living;

Therefore be it resolved that members of this House recognize the enormous sacrifice being made by caregivers in this province and urge the government to take the necessary steps to alleviate the pressures placed on caregivers created by an inefficient health care system.

Mr. Speaker, I would ask for waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

I hear several Noes.

The notice is tabled.

[Page 4636]

The honourable member for Richmond.

RESOLUTION NO. 2214

MR. MICHEL SAMSON: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas the Richmond County Literacy Society recently celebrated the opening of their new headquarters in D'Escousse; and

Whereas the literacy society is now working with 59 adult learners who are eager to upgrade their reading and writing skills; and

Whereas the society also offers programs through the Eastern Regional Health Board Community Health Promotion Fund including nutrition, stress management and motivation;

Therefore be it resolved that this House congratulate Millie Hatt and the Richmond County Literacy Society on the opening of their new offices and commend the work they are doing to promote important life skills in their community.

Mr. Speaker, I request waiver of notice and passage without debate.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Cape Breton Centre.

RESOLUTION NO. 2215

MR. FRANK CORBETT: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas yesterday the Young Liberals Association held a rally in Sydney; and

Whereas the Premier told them that everyone has to work together to improve the economy; and

[Page 4637]

Whereas at the Premier's Economic Summit last month no labour representatives, no members of community organizations, no Members of Parliament nor Opposition Members of this House were invited or present;

Therefore be it resolved that this House direct that the Premier should have ended his comments with a declaration to those present, do as I say and not as I do.

MR. SPEAKER: The notice is tabled.

The honourable member for Pictou East.

RESOLUTION NO. 2216

MR. JAMES DEWOLFE: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas despite being warned a year in advance of a pending crisis in medical oncology the Minister of Health ignored the problem to the point where Nova Scotia now faces a critical shortage of medical oncologists; and

Whereas the latest example of the part-time Health Minister's Johnny-come-lately approach to health care is at the Dartmouth General where overworked doctors had threatened to withdraw hospital services in order to get the minister's attention; and

Whereas the part-time Minister of Health has made it a habit to allow situations to reach near crisis proportions before promising that his department will take action;

Therefore be it resolved that the Premier recognize that his part-time Minister of Health is overwhelmed by the many issues he has allowed to go unresolved and that he help avoid new and urgent issues from developing by immediately appointing a full-time Minister of Health.

MR. SPEAKER: The notice is too long, but we will table it.

The honourable member for Halifax Bedford Basin.

RESOLUTION NO. 2217

MR. GERALD FOGARTY: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas over 50 members of the Dalhousie University swim team will be involved in Operation Red Nose over the holiday season; and

[Page 4638]

Whereas Operation Red Nose is designed to assist people who have overly refreshed themselves at a holiday function to arrive home safely; and

Whereas Operation Red Nose is designed as a fund-raiser for the swim team, with the people who receive a drive home making a donation to the team;

Therefore be it resolved that this House congratulate the Dalhousie University swim team and their community sponsors for their contribution to making the forthcoming holiday season a safe and enjoyable one.

I ask for waiver of notice, Mr. Speaker.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Yarmouth.

RESOLUTION NO. 2218

MR. JOHN DEVEAU: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas Nova Scotia's Ecology Action Centre and the Conservation Council of New Brunswick will be holding a press conference on Wednesday, December 2nd to announce the results of a report they commissioned on dumping and discarding in the groundfish fishery; and

Whereas the report contains the results of interviews with skippers and crew members in the mobile and fixed gear fleets, as well as fisheries representatives and DFO officials; and

Whereas fishers reported that thousands of pounds of fish may be dumped by a single boat on a single fishing trip;

Therefore be it resolved that the Minister of Fisheries and his federal counterpart read the report and act on its recommendations rather than the ill-founded assurances of his department officials.

[Page 4639]

Mr. Speaker, I request waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

I hear a No.

The notice is tabled.

The honourable Leader of the Progressive Conservative Party.

RESOLUTION NO. 2219

DR. JOHN HAMM: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas the Minister of Health responded to news that Dartmouth had a net loss of 22 physicians in the past few years by boasting of recent efforts to recruit new doctors; and

Whereas the Minister of Health knows full well that failed Liberal health reforms have largely contributed to a net loss of 180 full-time doctors across Nova Scotia; and

Whereas the Minister of Health has failed to secure adequate full-time doctors for Springhill, Yarmouth, Pictou, Weymouth, Dartmouth, Stellarton and numerous other communities throughout Nova Scotia;

Therefore be it resolved that the part-time Minister of Health acknowledge that his fictitious claims of recruitment success are cold comfort to the thousands of Nova Scotians who are still without a family physician.

MR. SPEAKER: The notice is tabled.

The honourable member for Annapolis.

RESOLUTION NO. 2220

MR. LAWRENCE MONTGOMERY: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas Adam Baxter, a student at Middleton Regional High School, made an impressive showing for 8th place in the world in the recent international Tae Kwon Do tournament in Istanbul, Turkey; and

[Page 4640]

Whereas this prestigious event followed Adam's gold medal win at the Tae Kwon Do Canadian National Championships in Quebec; and

Whereas as a result of his successful performance in Turkey, Adam is hoping to qualify for the Canadian Olympic Team which will compete in the Year 2000 Olympic Games in Sydney, Australia;

Therefore be it resolved that this House wish Adam Baxter luck as he takes another step toward his dream of being a member of Canada's Olympic Team and congratulate him on his recent outstanding success in the sport of Tae Kwon Do.

Mr. Speaker, I request waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Timberlea-Prospect.

RESOLUTION NO. 2221

MR. WILLIAM ESTABROOKS: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas Christmas concerts are an important part of school activities in the weeks before that festive season; and

Whereas these performances, year after year, are only possible because of the dedication of many teachers throughout our province; and

Whereas students, parents, relatives and other community members greatly appreciate these wonderful performances;

Therefore be it resolved that this House express its thanks to these teachers for their commitment and wish best of luck during a busy rehearsal schedule over the next few weeks before the Christmas break.

[Page 4641]

Mr. Speaker, I ask for waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member Digby-Annapolis.

RESOLUTION NO. 2222

MR. GORDON BALSER: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas the Minister responsible for Nova Scotia's Technology and Science Secretariat was reported on the front page of the November 4th edition of The Chronicle-Herald as saying, testing would begin by late summer to ensure all government computer equipment is Y2K compliant; and

Whereas one of the world's leading experts on Y2K and the overseer of operations for the United States Government to ensure computer operations are Y2K compliant, said last night on 60 Minutes, "that anyone waiting until late summer to test their equipment will be a lost cause if problems are found"; and

Whereas the Nova Scotia Government has not yet provided even so much as a progress report to date as to how it is handling the overall impact Y2K will have on the people of Nova Scotia;

Therefore be it resolved that the Minister responsible for the Technology and Science Secretariat immediately revisit the government's testing initiatives under Y2K and ensure that the welfare of all Nova Scotians will not be compromised.

MR. SPEAKER: That notice was too long, but I will table it anyway.

The honourable member for Inverness.

[Page 4642]

RESOLUTION NO. 2223

MR. CHARLES MACDONALD: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas at a weekend labour conference, the Leader of the NDP said his Party will fight to protect Devco; and

Whereas this stand directly contradicts the position of the NDP member for Halifax Chebucto who has been quoted many times saying he would like to see the Cape Breton coal industry closed; and

Whereas this is the same NDP member who announced his Party would not vote for the Financial Measures (1998) Act, only to have his Leader and caucus take the opposite position;

Therefore be it resolved that the NDP Leader immediately clarify his Party's position on Devco and ask for the resignation of his Finance Critic, who obviously holds the views of his Party in contempt.

MR. SPEAKER: The notice is tabled.

The honourable member for Halifax Chebucto.

RESOLUTION NO. 2224

MR. HOWARD EPSTEIN: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas an actuarial review of the Public Service Superannuation Plan of Nova Scotia indicates a small surplus; and

Whereas in a November 25th press release distributed in this House the Minister of Finance stated that with the plan confirmed to be in surplus, Public Service employees will receive a pension holiday early next year; and

Whereas the contact telephone number on the press release turns out to be that of well-known evangelist, Perry F. Rockwood and his Missionary Bible Church; (Laughter)

Therefore be it resolved that the Minister of Finance explain to this House, if he can, that the actuarial predictions for the Public Service Superannuation Plan are based on more than a wing and a prayer.

[Page 4643]

MR. SPEAKER: The notice is tabled.

The honourable member for Kings West.

RESOLUTION NO. 2225

MR. GEORGE MOODY: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas the chairperson of Nova Scotia's health information technology committee is quoted today as saying that the big players like Ontario and Alberta could be out in front of Nova Scotia a little bit in making Nova Scotia's health equipment Y2K compliant; and

Whereas the chairperson is also quoted as saying not all systems affected by the Year 2000 problem will be repaired or replaced on time; and

Whereas a recent report by Alberta's Auditor General noted the necessity to improve disaster planning in that province, while another report indicated that health authorities in Alberta were not sufficiently prepared to address the Y2K risk involving medical equipment and computer systems;

Therefore be it resolved that the Minister of Health has some serious questions which must be answered now to prevent additional chaos in the province's health care system.

MR. SPEAKER: The notice is tabled.

The honourable member for Dartmouth North.

RESOLUTION NO. 2226

MR. JERRY PYE: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas December 3rd is International Day for Disabled Persons; and

Whereas last year this House, upon motion by the Minister of Community Services, resolved to work closely with the Nova Scotia Disabled Persons Commission to ensure that government policies meet the needs of all persons with disabilities in Nova Scotia; and

Whereas the member for Kings North revealed to this House last week that despite this government's fine words, the percentage of disabled persons in the Civil Service is actually declining;

[Page 4644]

Therefore be it resolved that this House make December 3rd a meaningful day and commit to concrete measures rather than empty words to help disabled persons participate fully in society.

Mr. Speaker, I request waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

I hear a No.

The notice is tabled.

The honourable member for Argyle.

[2:45 p.m.]

RESOLUTION NO. 2227

MR. NEIL LEBLANC: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas the 1998-99 lobster season opened for 1,700 skippers and their crews this morning in southwestern Nova Scotia; and

Whereas the first two days of the lobster season are viewed as the most precarious, safety-wise, as more than 500,000 traps are dropped into the water which creates a potential hazard for fishermen to get tangled up, and amongst those my son who happens to be out there today; and

Whereas 13,500 tons of lobsters were landed during the 1997-98 lobster season, with a wharf-level value of $160 million;

Therefore be it resolved that all members of this Legislature acknowledge the importance of this industry and wish each and every lobster fisherman the very best with the launching of the 1998-99 lobster season.

Mr. Speaker, I request waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

[Page 4645]

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Richmond.

RESOLUTION NO. 2228

MR. MICHEL SAMSON: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas Friday morning on CBC Radio, the NDP member for Dartmouth-Cole Harbour was quoted as saying he spends his weekend evenings reading information from the Public Accounts Committee; and

Whereas this statement begs the question that maybe the NDP member should find himself a hobby; and

Whereas other NDP members have hobbies, for instance the member for Halifax Chebucto enjoys bean-counting; the member for Chester-St. Margaret's has his flip-flopping; and the member for Sackville-Cobequid likes pipe-measuring;

Therefore be it resolved that this House recommend that the member for Dartmouth-Cole Harbour follow the lead of his other caucus colleagues and find a hobby, because they all seem to have too much time on their hands.

Mr. Speaker, I request waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

I hear several Noes.

The notice is tabled.

The honourable member for Pictou West.

[Page 4646]

RESOLUTION NO. 2229

MR. CHARLES PARKER: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas the regional co-operative development centre, which shares resources with New Brunswick, P.E.I. and Nova Scotia, recently reported that it had created 11 new co-ops, 108 full-time and 54 part-time jobs; and

Whereas a comparison of the co-operative sectors in Quebec and Nova Scotia shows that Quebec's co-operative sector is 20 times as strong; and

Whereas analysts suggest Quebec's success in the co-operative sector is due to the close partnership with the provincial government;

Therefore be it resolved that the Minister of the Department of Economic Development take the advice of the regional-co-operative development centre's director and include co-op development as part of their economic strategy.

Mr. Speaker, I will request waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

I hear a No.

The notice is tabled.

The honourable member for Truro-Bible Hill.

RESOLUTION NO. 2230

MR. JAMES MUIR: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas a recent study has revealed that there has been an increase in drug and tobacco use among teenagers in Nova Scotia; and

Whereas in the past five years, the Minister of Education and his predecessor introduced public school programming intended to reduce drug and tobacco use by children and youth in Nova Scotia; and

[Page 4647]

Whereas it appears that the public school programming implemented by the Minister of Education and his predecessor has not been effective in reducing drug and alcohol use by teenagers;

Therefore be it resolved that the Minister of Education spend less time crowing about buildings and more time on improving the programming he prescribes for our public schools.

Mr. Speaker, I request waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

I hear a No.

The notice is tabled.

The honourable member for Hants East.

RESOLUTION NO. 2231

MR. JOHN MACDONELL: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas in the aftermath of the devastation caused by Hurricane Mitch, the people of Honduras are suffering immense hardship; and

Whereas the Nova Scotia Teachers Union is sponsoring an Angels for Honduras fund-raising campaign to aid all Hondurans; and

Whereas children across Nova Scotia will participate in the campaign by bringing donations to school and, for each donation, an angel will be displayed in their classroom;

Therefore be it resolved that this House congratulate the Nova Scotia Teachers Union and Nova Scotia students on their Angels for Honduras project that demonstrates the caring and commitment to those in need.

Mr. Speaker, I request waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

[Page 4648]

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Lunenburg.

RESOLUTION NO. 2232

MR. MICHAEL BAKER: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas two of Nova Scotia's great athletes, Seth and Sherman, presently live in Stanburne, Lunenburg County; and

Whereas Seth and Sherman are Limousin and Durham mix-breed oxen who under their teamster Neil Oickle, have won two international ox pulls this year, the first in Bridgewater and the second in Cumberland, Maine; and

Whereas Neil Oickle has spent countless hours training his team to ensure that they stay fit and ready, which includes working the oxen in the woods;

Therefore be it resolved that the House of Assembly congratulate Neil Oickle for his commitment to the traditional Lunenburg County skill of ox pulling and that the House wish him well in the future.

Mr. Speaker, I would ask for waiver of notice.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Halifax Citadel.

[Page 4649]

RESOLUTION NO. 2233

MR. PETER DELEFES: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas this December the Maritime Museum of the Atlantic celebrates its 50th birthday; and

Whereas the Maritime Museum continues to celebrate the rich maritime heritage of Atlantic Canada; and

Whereas this year saw the museum draw a record 235,000 people;

Therefore be it resolved that this House congratulate the Maritime Museum of the Atlantic on half a century of keeping our Maritime heritage alive.

Mr. Speaker, I would ask for waiver of notice.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Digby-Annapolis.

RESOLUTION NO. 2234

MR. GORDON BALSER: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas a new professional development program has recently been announced by the Institute of Small Business Counsellors with support from the Atlantic Canada Opportunities Agency; and

Whereas two Nova Scotians are among five Atlantic Canadians who have become the first small business counsellors certified under the program; and

Whereas small business continues to be the engine that drives Nova Scotia's economy;

[Page 4650]

Therefore be it resolved that the members of this House of Assembly congratulate Anna Hope, of Wolfville, and Howard McKinley, of Bedford, on their recent accreditation and wish them success.

Mr. Speaker, I would ask for waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Cape Breton The Lakes.

RESOLUTION NO. 2235

MS. HELEN MACDONALD: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas Cape Breton writers have established a first-class reputation in producing children's books; and

Whereas Douglas Arthur Brown has polished that reputation with his, The Magic Compass, A Christmas Fantasy, an extended fairy tale for children; and

Whereas The Magic Compass consists of 25 chapters meant to be read aloud nightly from December 1st through to Christmas Day;

Therefore be it resolved that this House congratulate Mr. Brown on his achievement and hope the imaginations of parents and children will soar as they lead up to Christmas with nightly visits to The Magic Compass.

Mr. Speaker, I would ask for waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

[Page 4651]

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Pictou East.

RESOLUTION NO. 2236

MR. JAMES DEWOLFE: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas Donald Sobey recently donated $3 million to his alma mater, the Queens University School of Business, to create the Donald Sobey Atlantic Leadership Fund; and

Whereas the fund will be used to provide scholarships for undergraduate business students from the Atlantic Provinces; and

Whereas the aim of the scholarship is to develop leaders who will return to the Atlantic Provinces to build a business;

Therefore be it resolved that the members of this Legislature thank Donald Sobey for his generous contribution and recognize his commitment to helping to secure a strong leadership base for the future development of business in the Atlantic Provinces.

Mr. Speaker, I would ask for waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Timberlea-Prospect.

RESOLUTION NO. 2237

MR. WILLIAM ESTABROOKS: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

[Page 4652]

Whereas volunteers from throughout the St. Margaret's Bay area continue to work together to meet the recreational needs of this fast-growing community; and

Whereas volunteers involved with the proposed Rails-to-Trails project in this area are relentlessly striving to meet the needs of all interested citizens; and

Whereas the board of directors will continue to meet to represent these interests;

Therefore be it resolved that this House offer its congratulations to the St. Margaret's Bay Area Rails-to-Trails group for its initiative and best of luck in its deliberations.

Mr. Speaker, I would ask for waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Kings North.

RESOLUTION NO. 2238

MR. GEORGE ARCHIBALD: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas in 1993-94, persons with disabilities represented 8.4 per cent of the workforce; and

Whereas in 1997-98, the percentage of persons with disabilities working for the Government of Nova Scotia dropped 2 per cent; and

Whereas despite these troubling and disappointing statistics, the Minister of Human Resources states that the government's Affirmative Action Program is, "working very well";

Therefore be it resolved that the Minister of Human Resources acknowledge that the government's Affirmative Action Program is clearly not working very well, and that he immediately sit down with representatives from the League for Equal Opportunities to critically evaluate the government's failed Affirmative Action Program.

[Page 4653]

Mr. Speaker, I ask for waiver of notice.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

I hear a No.

The notice is tabled.

The honourable member for Truro-Bible Hill.

RESOLUTION NO. 2239

MR. JAMES MUIR: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas Leslie Lake-Searle has enriched various facets of the music fabric of the Truro area for a number of years through teaching and performing; and

Whereas Leslie Lake-Searle, soprano, has joined with Ross Thompson, baritone, and the Rhapsody Quintet to release their first CD, The Melody Lingers On; and

Whereas this release will be celebrated today, November 30th, with a reception and short performance in Halifax;

Therefore be it resolved that all members of the House congratulate Leslie Lake-Searle, Ross Thompson and the Rhapsody Quintet on the launch of The Melody Lingers On and wish them every success in the future.

Mr. Speaker, I request waiver of notice.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Lunenburg.

[Page 4654]

RESOLUTION NO. 2240

MR. MICHAEL BAKER: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas the Mahone Bay School recently opened a recycling storage building to assist the school in its efforts to recycle; and

Whereas the Canada Trust Company and Legge's Storage Barns covered the cost of the building and its delivery; and

Whereas the school has an active environmental club;

Therefore be it resolved that the House of Assembly congratulate the Mahone Bay School, the Canada Trust Company and Legge's Storage Barns on their commitment to recycling and the environment.

Mr. Speaker, I request waiver of notice.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Argyle.

RESOLUTION NO. 2241

MR. NEIL LEBLANC: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas Bob Brooks' remarkable career as a photographer has earned him countless national and international awards; and

Whereas the former photographer with the Nova Scotia Government has had his photographs appear in such prestigious magazines as Newsweek, Time, Life and National Geographic; and

[Page 4655]

Whereas Mr. Brooks has once again displayed his remarkable talent for photography in a new and very popular book that chronicles the pictorial history of Yarmouth County;

Therefore be it resolved that this House congratulate Bob Brooks on yet another wonderful achievement and salute him for his pride in his work, in Yarmouth County and in his province.

Mr. Speaker, I ask for waiver.

MR. SPEAKER: There has been a request for waiver.

Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

The honourable member for Colchester-Musquodoboit Valley.

RESOLUTION NO. 2242

MR. BROOKE TAYLOR: Mr. Speaker, I hereby give notice that on a future day I shall move the adoption of the following resolution:

Whereas Nova Scotia companies are being essentially ignored in their attempts to provide goods and services for the construction of P3 schools in Nova Scotia; and

Whereas the Minister of Education and the Minister of Finance have ignored this situation to a point that a number of companies from out of the province are doing business that Nova Scotia companies should be doing; and

Whereas to add insult to injury, goods and services for a number of P3 school projects are coming in from the United States;

Therefore be it resolved that the Nova Scotia Legislature support the developers of P3 school projects having to abide by the Atlantic Procurement Policy as was signed on January 1, 1996.

[Page 4656]

MR. SPEAKER: The notice is tabled.

I am going to revert to the Order of Business, Introduction of Bills, as I skipped over that and neglected to call for Introduction of Bills.

INTRODUCTION OF BILLS

Bill No. 92 - Entitled an Act Respecting Certified Applied Science Technicians and Technologists. (Hon. Clifford Huskilson as a private member.)

MR. SPEAKER: Ordered that this bill be read a second time on a future day.

ORDERS OF THE DAY

GOVERNMENT BUSINESS

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable Government House Leader.

HON. MANNING MACDONALD: Mr. Speaker, would you please call the order of business, Public Bills for Third Reading.

[3:00 p.m.]

PUBLIC BILLS FOR THIRD READING

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable Government House Leader.

HON. MANNING MACDONALD: Mr. Speaker, would you please call Bill No. 22.

Bill No. 22 - Health Research Foundation Act.

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable Leader of the Opposition adjourned the debate on this bill and I believe he has approximately 40 minutes remaining.

The honourable Leader of the Opposition.

MR. ROBERT CHISHOLM: Mr. Speaker, I certainly won't be taking anywhere near that length of time. I had the opportunity during debate on Friday to canvass this issue. I laid out what I thought were the reasons why this bill needed to be supported and why this caucus had supported it. I provided indications of why it was that we felt in this caucus that the health research foundation was long overdue and that we encouraged the government to ensure that it was supported financially, as well as legislatively. I know there are other members of my caucus who want to make similar representations.

[Page 4657]

It is fair to say that I very much support this bill. When the announcement was made in 1993 by the then campaigning Liberal Party Leader, John Savage, I supported it. We advocated for it throughout that period and when the campaigning Liberal Leader in this last election, the member for Cape Breton North, advocated that the health research foundation be established and $5 million this year be allocated, I said, long overdue and good news.

We were extremely disappointed that there was no discussion in the Speech from the Throne about the health research foundation and about that $5 million. It is fair to say, we were extremely surprised, if not shocked to see in the budget that there was no money allocated for the health research foundation. I still believe that had we not raised such a fuss and had others not raised such a fuss, the minister would never have introduced Bill No. 22 in the House.

So I am glad this bill is here and that we have had an opportunity to debate it. In the Law Amendments Committee we had representations from those people directly affected, directly involved and who will be directly involved in the operations of the health research foundation. I think we were able to make changes to the bill in the Law Amendments Committee and subsequently in the Committee of the Whole House on Bills, which made that a better piece of legislation. I talked about some of those changes earlier in my intervention and in particular, amendments which dealt with the whole independence of the operation of the health foundation, independent from the vagaries of the political winds that are blowing at any particular time. So, I am glad we were able to do that.

I indicate again to all members of the House, I think this is a bill worth supporting and I know that other members of the caucus of the Official Opposition feel similarly and would like to make their own representations on why this is an important piece of legislation. So thank you, Mr. Speaker, for the opportunity to stand and speak on this bill and I look forward to hearing what other members have to say. Thank you. (Applause)

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable member for Hants East.

MR. JOHN MACDONELL: Mr. Speaker, I would like to make some comments regarding the Health Research Foundation Act and also the need for such a bill. I think it is imperative that we take a look at what actually has happened in the past that would bring us to this point at the present and for this need. Nova Scotia is the only province that does not have legislation to this effect and so I think it is to the benefit of all Nova Scotians that this Act has been brought forward.

The Nova Scotia Health Research strategy which led to this bill and I will quote from their booklet, " . . . will enhance health research excellence, capacity and relevance in a balanced way with respect to a broad definition of health research. The strategy will be committed to quality, collaboration, integration and support of inquiry, analysis, and

[Page 4658]

dissemination. This will provide a framework to address our health goals, health problems and will inform health policy, programs and services.".

Well, Mr. Speaker, if we were to consider a world that had no coordination of health research, this bill will allow a coordinated effort by health care professionals. There was a time that there was no such thing. If we consider the mechanisms that led to research of any kind, scientific research, which to a great extent has all led to health research since most of the research or investigation that has gone on through history has been to the benefit of the health of the individuals involved.

As I go through some of the actions of individuals over time, I would like members to be aware, or draw their attention to how uncoordinated all of these efforts were. In other words, some scientist would work on a particular area with absolutely no knowledge that another scientist in another part of the world would be working in a similar area and, in some cases, no knowledge of the information that they had achieved in their research, no way to share that information and, certainly, the health research foundation will allow for this to happen on a far more coordinated basis.

Mr. Speaker, if we even go back to the simplest of times or to the simplest of thought and think about people's analyses of exactly what life was on this planet or how it was generated on this planet, then we can see the very basics of research, as people would have called it at that time. If we think of how there was an improper dissemination of information; in other words, people who were regarded as renowned in their society, as knowledgeable, et cetera, if they had a wrong idea, that idea would be perpetuated over time before there would be any new information to clarify it.

AN HON. MEMBER: Are you talking about the NDP again?

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please.

MR. JOHN MACDONELL: No, I am not.

If we take something so simple as the idea of spontaneous generation - which was the notion that living things could be generated from non-living material - I am sure there are probably members in this House who have talked to people in the past who would have made statements that caused them to believe that these people still believe in the idea of spontaneous generation, even though they never gave or coined the term, spontaneous generation. The idea that people believe that frogs were generated in the mud at the bottom of a swamp and those frogs were not aestivating in that mud over the winter, but yet were generated by the mud is a fairly commonly held view and you can still talk to people who believe that.

[Page 4659]

We are talking about an idea that has been questioned for hundreds of years; actually, Aristotle is one of the first people that has been known to support the idea of spontaneous generation. He said that spontaneous generation seemed to confirm people's observations. So, one of the mechanisms that we believe as part of science is observation; if it tends to confirm your observations, then you would tend to believe it far more readily.

People would notice mice running away from a bunch of bags thrown in the corner and think that the bags gave rise to the mice because, when the bags were put there, there were no mice in that building or in that room. Nobody thought that the fact that the bags were there either provided a hiding place or, if they were empty bags of grain, there might be some kernels of grain still in those bags that would attract the mice, and if somebody walked into that room then the mice would run and, therefore, the conclusion that the bags somehow gave rise to the mice.

Now, there have been a number of scientists over the years who have done some research in this area. One of the first ones who actually tried to prove the idea of spontaneous generation, and believed that he did was a Scottish scientist named John Needham. John Needham put a broth into a flask which he considered to contain micro-organisms and boiled that broth for a certain period of time with the knowledge that if you boiled it, then you would destroy the organisms inside the flask and then stopped that flask with a cork.

After a period of time he noticed that micro-organisms reappeared in the flask and, therefore, John Needham said there, I have proved spontaneous generation but 50 years later an Italian scientist, Lazzaro Spallanzani, redid Needham's experiment but if we consider the period in the time-frame, there is no way for Spallanzani to talk to Needham and, therefore, actually there was no way for Spallanzani to be particularly aware of Needham's experiment.

If we look at the health research foundation, we see that we have a coordinated effort for people to disseminate knowledge that is readily available and they can keep track of the information they have and somehow other scientists are aware of what has already been done. In Spallanzani's experiment he basically redid what Needham had done and in redoing that experiment he concluded that Needham had not boiled his flask long enough and that a cork would not be justified in keeping organisms out. In other words, because micro-organisms are carried by the air, they could filter down between the cork and the flask and, therefore, contaminate the solution.

So what he did was boiled the flask longer and then melted the end of the flask shut in order to keep micro-organisms from entering and as long as he kept the end of the flask melted shut, then there was no way for organisms to get in. Spallanzani was aware of that and every time he broke the end of the flask at the end of his experiment, new organisms got into the flask but Spallanzani's flaw was that he could not decide how to close the flask and still keep micro-organisms out.

[Page 4660]

That step came with Louis Pasteur. Louis Pasteur developed what was regarded as a goose-neck flask. Those flasks are still available for view. What he did with his goose-neck flask was, he heated the broth inside the flask. That caused condensation in the flask. The fluid settled in the neck of the flask and, therefore, prevented micro-organisms as they entered the flask . . .

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please. This is very interesting but I do not think it has too much to do with the principle of the bill. So I would ask the member to draw his bow in a bit and return to the principle of the bill.

MR. JOHN MACDONELL: Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and definitely I will try. I think it is important to recognize that if we have come to this bill at this point in time, then we have to realize what happened historically that has disallowed that to happen and why it is that scientists today recognize a need for such a bill because without some coordinated effort of the planning that they have been able to do, and you have to realize, I think, what is it that has allowed the process that these scientists worked under to exist. If we consider the time-frame at which they worked and the lack of knowledge that they had and the lack of instruments that they had, then we have to recognize the only people who could actually carry out this type of work would be what kind of people? They would have to be people who did not have a family to worry about for the most part or they would have to be people who had some large endowment of funds that allowed them to do this.

If we considered the 1600's, the 1700's or the 1800's, there would be such a small part of the population that was not out there every day working to feed their families that, therefore, these few people, and we only have a few historically over time that were ever able to carry on scientific research and for the most part this research by lots of people would not even be considered scientific. In the case of the health research foundation, which we have heard should be funded substantially, then we have individuals whose monetary needs are taken care of, both so that they have the time to do the work, plus they have the monetary requirement in order to enable them to do the work. That includes the staffing that they need, plus the technical equipment that they need, as well.

[3:15 p.m.]

Mr. Speaker, if I can ask you a question, am I allowed to embark on that equipment?

MR. SPEAKER: I beg your pardon?

MR. JOHN MACDONELL: Am I allowed to embark on the history of the equipment that is . . .

MR. SPEAKER: No, I don't think so. No.

[Page 4661]

MR. JOHN MACDONELL: Louis Pasteur and his goose-neck flask prove that spontaneous generation did not occur, that organisms were created from other organisms, and he was an individual who made the statement in the field, (Interruptions) He could have used a health research foundation, that is right. He was an individual who stated that in the field of observation, chance favours only the prepared mind. Now the question is, what did he mean by that? Well, what he is saying is that when it comes to research, you have to have people with a background in the particular area in which they work, because it doesn't matter how much you plan for something, other things will be interjected into what you do, and because of that background knowledge you will have, therefore you can pick up on significant events that occur in your research that other people would not.

By having trained scientists covered under this Health Research Foundation, they have a far better chance of picking up on the unexpected events that become significant in our society, rather than just assuming that because somebody has a science degree, that they are trained in a particular area and that information that they will carry out will produce the desired result. There are people who spend a lifetime doing research that produces no result that they desired.

The other day, my honourable colleague from Chester-St. Margaret's mentioned Alexander Fleming. Here is an example of Louis Pasteur's statement. Here is an individual who was doing research on bacteria, but he was not trying to find penicillin, didn't know such a substance even existed. Because of the research he was doing in another area, he noticed that something was causing the bacteria he was trying to grow not to grow. This is an example of Pasteur's statement that in the field of observation, chance favours only the prepared mind. How many Petri dishes of bacteria would be thrown out time after time before somebody noticed that something was stopping the growth of that bacteria?

To have the foundation is a major step, to have coordinated information is a major step, and therefore, we can see that in the case of Alexander Fleming, even luck was a major step, but there is no way of knowing that once somebody applies for a grant or gets a grant to do a particular piece of research that that particular piece of research will have the desired end. The scientists never know that when they start. What has happened over time, we have come from someone like Aristotle to the present day, and scientists work on what we refer to as a research method or the scientific method, and the only way to start any question is to go on the idea of defining the problem. Without a problem, there is no need for the research. Research is not done just because you feel like it, you should address some need in society, and that certainly in health would be what this research foundation will deal with . . .

MR. SPEAKER: I wonder if the honourable member would permit an introduction by another member?

MR. JOHN MACDONELL: Certainly.

[Page 4662]

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable member for Chester-St. Margaret's.

DR. HINRICH BITTER-SUERMANN: Mr. Speaker, on a point of introduction, in the gallery opposite, Mr. Martin Haase, from Chester Basin is visiting the House today. He has been an invaluable contributor to environmental and health discussions in my community. I would like Mr. Haase to stand up and receive the warm applause of this House. (Applause)

MR. SPEAKER: I would ask the honourable member to try and abide by the principle of Bill No. 22 that is presently being debated.

MR. JOHN MACDONELL: Mr. Speaker, I will try. Now we have seen that research doesn't necessarily have a template that gives you a desired result. If it could do that, then we would have a much simpler way of answering questions related to disease. That has never been easy for people; it has only come from associated work at a glance that people had noticed what is going on in society and then have applied their knowledge to that.

Alexander Fleming was one example, Edward Jenner, an English doctor, was another example and he is an individual that had years of experience and we could say years in research training, even though he acquired his training on the job. This bill is not designed so that people acquire their training on the job. It is designed so that people will be trained in the foundation prior to getting to the foundation. They will be looking for the best people with the best training in order to carry out the work of this health foundation.

In the case of Edward Jenner, that was not the case. The man was a doctor for sure, there was no getting around that, but because he was a doctor was not enough to ensure that he could find a cure for smallpox. How many doctors would have watched people die over the years of smallpox? How many would have watched people die from smallpox, even after Jenner had discovered a cure for smallpox? Here is the problem with the dissemination of information in the past, which should not be the case, in the health research foundation.

Any information generated from this research will be made available to the scientific community so that other research will go on in relation to it. There is no doubt that doctors or scientists are not going to take information from the research foundation and assume that this is the end-all and be-all for that information. They will take that information, do their own research based on that information and either confirm or say that there is a problem with this research, which is not the case that we could have had in earlier times.

In Edward Jenner's case, he moved from the country to the city and in that movement of dealing with people with smallpox cases, he noticed there were fewer smallpox cases in the country than there were in the city. After years of noticing this and thinking about this, he came up with a hypothesis that there must be some connection between . . .

[Page 4663]

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please. We are getting a history of research in the medical field, I understand that, but this bill is to establish a research foundation. The principle of that is the setting up of this foundation and I would ask the honourable member to please try to stick to those particular parameters.

MR. JOHN MACDONELL: Thank you, Mr. Speaker, I appreciate your intervention and will try to stick to the purpose and the benefit of the bill. It is the history of what we have been through that requires the need for the foundation today. (Interruption) The lack of research in Nova Scotia probably has its own history of why that hasn't happened. The recommendations are for the foundation to conduct ongoing facilitative consultation and communication with government, regional health boards, community health boards, research at universities, non-governmental organizations, voluntary health organizations, health professionals, consumers and individual members of the general public on health-related matters to identify research priorities.

One of the good things about this foundation is that it will be at arm's length of government and therefore the scientific community will have a major role in determining where this research goes. It will also allocate funds to support Nova Scotia's health research priorities and health research capacity development, and maintain ethical and scientific standards in health research by developing a rigorous peer review system so that scientific and ethical standards are met and are the cornerstone upon which distribution of funds will be based.

We have to look at the benefits to research only with regard to the disadvantages of research in society. We know that the fact that research has been carried out is not good enough if we are just going to assume that the information we get the first time is the only information that is available. Just as people will go to their doctor and go for a second opinion, then there will be conclusions that will be drawn from research that will still have to be re-analyzed, restated, re-examined.

Other recommendations require dissemination processes for all projects for the uptake of health research findings. I think I have stated this on a number of occasions. The advantage of this, Mr. Speaker, certainly if we look at what I have talked about in the past, where people were either divided by geography, they were either divided by language, they were either divided by time, in the case of some experiments being done 50 or 100 years apart and no great way to disseminate that information. Provide a forum for productive interactions among stakeholders in health research and linkages such as technology transfer for product development and application, and coordinate and promote effective communication of health research results and policy analysis to relevant policy makers and decision makers.

Mr. Speaker, I support this bill and certainly encourage the House to do the same. Thank you.

[Page 4664]

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable member for Preston.

MS. YVONNE ATWELL: Mr. Speaker, I, too, would like to take a few minutes to speak on Bill No. 22, the Health Research Foundation Act, and to talk about it in terms which have a great deal of relevance to me personally, as well as to the Black community of Nova Scotia. My experience in Nova Scotia in terms of health research for African Nova Scotians is practically non-existent. As a matter of fact, when the Black Women's Health Program was established through a group of women who decided to go out and look for statistical information or any kind of information to assist them to establish their program, they themselves were shocked to find out that there was no statistical information, there were no impact studies, there was no research at all in terms of mental or physical health within the African Nova Scotian community.

This is rather disturbing, seeing that the African Nova Scotian community has been a part of the history of Nova Scotia for more than 200 years and that there have been issues over that time period that were particular to African Nova Scotians' health and have not been looked at. For example, the Black Women's Health Program then set out to find some funding for research in their communities. They did get a little bit of funding from a few sources to do some community-type of research, basically some grass-roots research where they got many people in the community, especially women, to talk about some health issues. That, of course, is not enough, so I see the Health Research Foundation that would be established would be able to, maybe, help develop a structure that would be particular to the African Nova Scotia community.

Also, during the time that the Black Women's Health Program was established, they had to look to the United States for the little bit of research that they could find. Of course, there are many factors that are different in the United States as it relates to African people across the country, so some of those statistics were not valid.

The other thing that we have been worried about within the community is that last year we had the breast cancer mobile unit that came out to the community and out of the five women who went to the mobile to be examined for breast cancer, there were two women who they discovered that had lumps in their breasts. I find that those statistics are extremely high and that through the establishment of a research foundation, there may be an opportunity to provide information to many of these women who do not feel or do not understand the relevance of going for regular breast cancer examinations. That is based on the historical element of our community where people have sort of lived outside of the mainstream, outside of the cities, and do not see themselves as being part of that. They do not have a lot of information, so there is a lot of work that needs to be done.

[Page 4665]

[3:30 p.m.]

The Health Research Foundation also would be helpful in advancing some studies on sickle-cell anaemia. I know there is a little bit that is done now within the Province of Nova Scotia, however, to my understanding there may not be anything that is educational or consistent in terms of the genetic aspects of sickle-cell anaemia. Also, through this Black Women's Health Program, there were a number of women who randomly went for testing for sickle-cell anaemia and found that they carried the trait and they did not know this before. They, in turn, had to have their children tested.

A Health Research Foundation that would be established must take into consideration all factors of the community and all issues that pertain to health. Heart disease and high blood pressure are other elements of the community that need to be researched, to be looked at, so that when we go out to find out what is happening, to move our communities forward, that we have some information, some statistical data on what we do to base our needs on.

The ethno-cultural community, new immigrants, all of those issues are very important to be part of a Health Research Foundation, all those elements of the community. AIDS, of course, is also rampant throughout the world and, in our community, it is no different; therefore, information, further research based on how communities are structured, how they have been designed, is also very important.

The other thing I wanted to talk about for a minute around the issue of health - and it is something that I know people are quite uncomfortable at times talking about - is the whole area of discrimination as it relates to physical and mental health, particularly within communities that are poor, women, racially visible communities, and new immigrants to this country. The issue of racism needs to be considered as a factor in terms of health for those groups within this province.

A Health Research Foundation ideally, in my opinion, if it is established, must also encourage, support and involve the groups that I talked about, as being part of their board or committees, to be able to support them in any programs or any kind of design that they would like to see to move their communities forward, and to have the kind of open dialogue within the communities to ensure that there is proper representation, that those communities need to thrive and grow through a Health Research Foundation. The broad title of a health foundation, to me, encompasses every aspect of the human being. We talk about the physical health, the mental health, the spiritual health, is all-encompassing and I do not think that we can do one without the other.

Mr. Speaker, I believe that this is a good bill. I support this bill and I would very much like to see all of the issues that I have just mentioned incorporated into some type of structure within the Health Research Foundation, so that all the communities of Nova Scotia will feel a part of this. Thank you. (Applause)

[Page 4666]

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable member for Sackville-Cobequid.

MR. JOHN HOLM: Mr. Speaker, it is a privilege to have the opportunity to stand up and to speak this afternoon for a few minutes on the bill that is before us for third reading, that is the Health Research Foundation.

I say, Mr. Speaker, that I think this is a very important piece of legislation and it is one that I am pleased to see that the government, although they were, it really appears, to have been dragged to do this, kicking and screaming, because, of course, they had made the commitment way back, as far as 1993, that this Health Research Foundation was going to be established. I guess it is almost a record for this government that they are only a little over five years late in fulfilling that commitment but, nonetheless, Mr. Speaker, we are certainly pleased to see that it is coming forward because it is going to be an extremely important addition here in the Province of Nova Scotia. We are, I believe, the last province in this country, the last province that has a major medical school and has major medical centres, to have developed such a research foundation. So it is about time that the government and the Province of Nova Scotia came into the 1990's because this program is, indeed, long overdue.

Now, Mr. Speaker, there are a number of features that I like about this research foundation and one of them is that it is not going to be something that is going to be scripted by the government. Now, let's not kid ourselves, the government is going to have a great deal of control over this foundation because we know that one of the major concerns that is going to exist for this foundation, one of the major challenges that is going to be continuing is the level of funding and whether or not they will actually have the funding levels to be able to carry on the very important kind of research that needs to be done and that, of course, is going to be contingent upon the resources being available.

In theory, certainly, and it is a very important theory, is that the research foundation is going to be at arm's length from the government. Government can, and I am sure will, try to have some input into the priorities that the research foundation will be following and you might say that they are going to have a rather big club in trying to influence those priorities because if they don't like the kind of things that the foundation is looking into, the government has the club of not agreeing to provide the level of funding that is necessary. That, if the government does that, so long as the requests are reasonable would, I believe, be extremely short-sighted and harmful for the people of this province.

This research foundation allows for there to be a really broad-based consultation.. Now, that's important. It is important that it not just be words but it is important because it will allow for those health care needs, and health care needs can be very broad, it doesn't only have to mean the actual medical conditions that somebody could be suffering with, the health foundation could, through this broad consultation identify what it considers to be the priorities, that could be a matter of looking at environmental protection or environmental illness and taking a look at what it is, why is it, trying to identify the causes, why people who

[Page 4667]

are living in certain areas or who are working in certain environments are actually suffering from illnesses or suffering from symptoms that are unique to that workplace.

We all know about Camp Hill. I know that the government, of course, is very reticent to recognize environmental illness even exists, however, anybody with any common sense who takes a look at it, Mr. Speaker, recognizes things ain't the way they used to be and that people are becoming ill in ways and that there are certain kinds of things whether that be asthma or what have you that certainly are uncommon from previous years. So things have changed and the research foundation can take a look at that.

They can also take a look at social issues, because social issues do have a major impact upon the health of individuals. Mr. Speaker, as I understand it, from the research foundation, they can take a look at nutrition and they may be able to provide some assistance to the Minister of Community Services. Of course, if you are unable to survive and unable to provide nutritious meals for family and for your children then your children are going to be less well. In fact, they may be far more prone to illness than those who are able to come from a fortunate family where there is sufficient income to ensure that those children do, in fact, receive a balanced diet, one with all the nutrition that they need so that they can grow properly, so that they are able to learn in school properly, so that they will be able to develop to their potentials.

Under this Health Research Foundation, the limits are very broad and I am sure the Minister of Community Services, herself, would want to ensure that the research foundation would be looking at those kinds of issues and that would give her more clout with her Cabinet colleagues to provide for a proper level of funding, a proper level of assistance. The minister, I don't know if she wants to stand up with those encouraging words. (Interruption) The minister says that she is listening carefully and I am just very pleased to hear that because that is an extremely important issue.

We all know and the Minister of Education would know as would all others who have, at one time or other, served young people of this province in the classroom, they know that those children who come to school unfed or without proper nourishment are not able to perform as well as others who have a proper diet and proper nutrition. So there are social elements that they can have a look at and those social elements have an impact upon health and that, therefore, is the kind of thing that this research foundation would have within their mandate the ability to look at.

They can look at the medical illnesses that exist in particular areas. They can look at the kinds of treatments that may or may not be appropriate. My colleague for Preston spoke about the African Canadians and about the kinds of research. We do know that traditionally, the pharmaceutical companies and others who do much of the research, they tend to do the research on a particular group of people. The particular group of people that the major research is done on, whether that be for different types of treatment through medicines that

[Page 4668]

can be offered, traditionally it is males who are white. The research findings that they get by doing the research on males who are white does not necessarily apply equally to those who come from a different race or from a different gender.

The research foundation will have the opportunities to look at these kinds of things. In so doing, they may actually be able to come up with new products, new treatments that can, in fact lead to new jobs in this province, new economic wealth, new growth in those products, as well as the more important benefit in the long term and that is improved health for the citizens of this province and in our world community.

They can take a look at psychological issues. They can take a look at the mental health issues around this province. They can take a look at Cape Breton, for example, to try to figure out why it is that industrial Cape Breton has had such a high cancer rate. They could take a look at what the impacts from the tar ponds and that ooze that seeps out around Frederick Street could be having upon the health of their residents who live in that community. They could take a look at your community, Mr. Speaker, or they could take a look at my community and try to identify the health care needs working in cooperation with the community health boards, which hopefully one day this government will actually empower as the Blueprint Committee had recommended, so that they can actually have powers in helping to set directions for the regional health boards.

They could be taking a look at the Cobequid Multi-Service Centre and trying to find out what are the weaknesses in terms of the health care services being delivered to the residents who live in the Sackville community and the surrounding areas that are served by it. They could identify, I am sure and others have done this but they could reinforce the knowledge that the level of services need to be expanded, that the facility is inadequate and that it cannot possibly meet all of the identified health care needs, the need to have proper emergency services 24 hours a day, the need to expand the mental health facilities and the list goes on, the kinds of things that, of course, the government knows or should know.

[3:45 p.m.]

The research foundation has the ability to set priorities. I am using my community as an example, but they could be looking at a series of communities across the province, trying to identify where those needs are and, through that research, be able to provide to the Premier and to his colleagues suggestions and advice on how those gaps can, in fact, be met.

Another important thing, one of many. Nova Scotia has suffered throughout much of our history from what people have traditionally called the brain drain. We have, in this province, some excellent post-secondary education facilities. We have a younger generation which is second to none in terms of their abilities, in terms of their willingness to work, to educate themselves and, importantly, to contribute to society as a whole. I do not know if there is anybody in this House who would disagree with me - if there is, I hope that they will

[Page 4669]

stand in their place and identify themselves - when I say that I would stack our young people in the Province of Nova Scotia up, favourably, against those from anywhere else across this country.

We have in this province and we are turning out in this province many young, capable researchers. One of the major problems is that they have had to leave Nova Scotia in order to find employment. To leave Nova Scotia, also, to be able to find the revenues to be able to assist them to do the kind of research for which they are trained and which they know will contribute and will assist mankind. They have to leave because there has not been the seed money to help them get started.

Trees don't just grow. You don't just plant a seed today and tomorrow you have your giant oak or your tall pine tree or spruce or whatever the case may be. You have to nurture that seed along. Some will develop faster than others and some actually won't develop or grow at all. It depends upon the soil in which they are planted and the conditions under which they are growing. Unfortunately, a lot of those seeds, a lot of those ideas that have germinated in Nova Scotia, have not been able to grow because they have not been properly nurtured.

In other parts of this country and North America, in fact around the world, you really have several levels of funding. You have the seed money which is essential to try to develop your idea, to grow it to a stage, grow it to a point, where you can then take that idea, take that knowledge out and try to attract other dollars that would then augment that, that would be needed for the ongoing growth of that idea and the development of it.

What this foundation will do - if I can make my analogy make any sense at all - is it will allow those young researchers, or those from away who want to come to locate here, it will provide them with some seed money to help them to develop their ideas to the stage where they can then go out and try to elicit support, increased funding, from others to expand on that.

We hear all the time where somebody has an idea, they have it to a certain stage, but you cannot go any further unless you get that supplementary funding, the major dollars, the major commitments. What this will do, it will allow Nova Scotian researchers the seed money to develop their ideas so that they will be able to compete on the national and international level to attract those funds, to enable those ideas, those products, that research to develop here at home in Nova Scotia. That is extremely important for the young people of this province who want to get into this field, whether that be in actual medical research, whether they want to be setting up labs in this province, or whether it is going to be kind of a social research that is attached to or has implications for the medical. It is all extremely important.

[Page 4670]

This then goes back to the Minister of Finance, the Minister of Health, and to the Premier, the First Minister of this Province, to ensure, they have a tremendous responsibility, this group and the group who will follow them in a number of months. It places tremendous responsibility on them to ensure that the research foundation is actually going to be receiving the kind and level of funding that it needs to have in order for it to do its good work.

The products of this research don't happen instantly. They aren't there the day after you put the money into it. It can be long, it can be methodical, but the rewards, the benefits can be extremely beneficial to this community - meaning Nova Scotia - and to Canada as a whole, and of course, Canada means canada from the word canada which means community in the First language.

We can look at MedCan. (Interruptions) Somebody said I must have been watching television, I want to assure the member that that was something that many years ago - in another life when I taught junior high, Grade 7 actually - it was something that Grade 7 students, and to the Minister of Education, if the program hasn't changed over those many years since I did it, that was something that in fact was even in the Grade 7 history course in the Province of Nova Scotia. I think it is an extremely important concept, and it ties in with the Health Research Foundation, because what is a community? A community is a group of people who live together, who work and share, and we have the tradition that communities help their community members. Canada is a community of communities.

One of the things that we know, with changes in technology and so on, is that the world is becoming a much smaller community. It is nice that one of the kinds of research that was done in this province by MedCan, developing the new program for faster tests for HIV, that that is the kind of research that was done here in Nova Scotia. It has had remarkable success in developing this new technique, and that new technique is going to benefit, hopefully, millions of people around this world.

Although that is the number one concern, that it is helping our brothers and sisters worldwide in the combat of HIV and AIDS, but on a personal note here in Nova Scotia, it has the added benefit that it is also going to create economic activity in this province. There are going to be jobs created here. There is going to be spin-off economic activity. That will also enhance Nova Scotia's reputation for its research, and for the calibre of the researchers in this province and for what people in this province can actually do.

This research foundation is going to augment, it is going to help out with this kind of thing, and we sincerely hope that as a result of their efforts, there will be many more of these kinds of developments, and that we can develop in this province, on top of the expert facilities, the expert staff, the expert researchers that we already have. Let's not sell ourselves short, within this province we have, with all of our various universities and our other facilities, some extremely capable people. We have many more capable people, who I mentioned earlier,

[Page 4671]

leave the people as part of that brain drain, because the opportunities aren't here for them or haven't been here for them. Hopefully, this will be done.

Mr. Speaker, with those words, I don't know if you can tell how I will be voting on this bill from my comments, but I want to assure people that I think this is a very positive piece of legislation. It is very forward-looking, and I am sure that the Minister of Community Services will be anxious for them to be looking at things that are socially related, things like nutrition and levels of assistance that are provided for the poor and also to the working poor in this province, taking a look at even the social impacts in education that they can do from this, taking a look at the psychological and the mental health damage that is done by poverty, and maybe suggesting ways for the government to try to address these very important social, yet health-related issues.

There are many more, of course, that I could talk about. Certainly there are many issues that one would hope they would look into with regard to Cape Breton and elsewhere across this province, but I will leave those comments about what the health research foundation can do and the positive work for the region of Cape Breton to a member from Cape Breton to address. So, with those few words, I will take my seat and I am proud to say that I will be voting for this bill at the end of third reading. (Interruption)

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please.

The honourable member will ignore the chit-chat.

MR. HOLM: Somebody from the Third Party, I am not sure if they are asking me to repeat what I was saying or that they did not hear it before. With the consent of the House, I can start over. (Interruptions)

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please.

MR. HOLM: The government members said that they were listening, so I take it that that is . . .

MR. SPEAKER: Order, please. The honourable member will ignore the chit-chat from across the floor.

MR. HOLM: Thank you. They were being nice, Mr. Speaker. It is hard to ignore them when they are being nice, it happens so rarely. With those few words and with the positive encouragement from the government members opposite, who are being nice to me today, I will indicate that I will be voting in support of this legislation when it finally reaches the floor for a third reading vote, probably later today or possibly tomorrow, whenever it happens, when people have finished the debate on this bill. Thank you.

[Page 4672]

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable member for Cape Breton The Lakes.

MS. HELEN MACDONALD: Mr. Speaker, I would like to rise for a few moments to add my voice of support for this bill, an Act to Establish the Nova Scotia Health Research Foundation. The health research foundation will "assist, collaborate with and fund individuals and organizations conducting health research . . ."; certainly, in our province, that is, indeed, a move forward.

Health promotion and health care are critical issues for everyone, but especially for us in Nova Scotia because, as we learned very clearly during our recent campaigns, people are concerned in Nova Scotia about health, about health care and about our health promotion and our policies around health. So medical research certainly will assist in that very endeavour.

We must ensure, as we move forward with this foundation, that the objectives of the foundation reflect what it is that the 1995 Health Research Task Force set out as its definition about research. Research, we know, regardless of the profession we would be considering as an important aspect, or an important component, but certainly research around the area of health care is critical and is essential, and what we know is that it cannot be put off any longer in this province. I am sure that if we talked to individuals out there, we will be told that they are awaiting such a bill because they do know the importance that this will have around health care.

[4:00 p.m.]

We know that there is definitely no shortage of issue that can be addressed when we talk about health research. Although when we think of education and young people, we think basically of learning in the respect of how we have defined learning in our education system. What we do know is how very much what happens in classrooms and what happens with young people is impacted very directly by the health and well-being of those young people that we have before us. Those of us who were in classrooms over the last number of years know that children are coming to school and we are identifying long before they come to school, students who have a variety of inabilities or disabilities or dysfunctions that as educators, people are not able to necessarily address because it is not the result of that part of their learning and often things that are related to the health of them, of their families and of communities.

We can see that this research foundation, looking at the broad issues of diseases among children, would be able to perform certainly a valuable service to Nova Scotians. So the building of a community and building of a province depends so much on our youth and young people. Any research that would help in helping us to understand what is happening with some young people as a result of the environment and as a result of their diets and as a result of many issues that their families have to deal with, I think this will be certainly be something that will be welcomed. (Interruption)

[Page 4673]

Mr. Speaker, if I may, I had a request for someone to do an introduction so I will yield the floor.

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable member for Halifax Fairview.

MS. EILEEN O'CONNELL: Mr. Speaker, I want to rise at this moment to welcome again to this House, a group of community activists from both Pictou and from Judique-Creignish, who have been here today to meet and visit with members of this House. I believe they are spread among two galleries. There is certainly a group of them in the east gallery and I believe some in the west as well. I would ask the members of this House, particularly in light of their diligence as citizen activists, to give them an especially warm welcome here today. Perhaps they would rise and identify themselves. (Applause)

MS. HELEN MACDONALD: Mr. Speaker, we do know that research will certainly be a benefit or an opportunity for us to look at some of the health issues around our youth and children. As well, many issues have been, and others have mentioned them before me, around the issues of women and women's health. Obviously, there is a need for some understanding of that and where we are going with that in this province and what it is that we can do to better service, especially when we think of women, speaking of rural women and some of their needs.

Another area that has been mentioned, and for those of us who have a relationship in our communities with aboriginal people, we know some of the health issues around that community that certainly need and require insight and study. Being able to engage people in those communities, as well, in some research would certainly prove to be most advantageous. We know that in some communities, there are very serious health issues and health problems. Again, a research foundation like this would bring forth many benefits.

The area that interests me the most in this, and I am sure my other colleague from Cape Breton will talk about it in more detail than I, but the whole issue around what is referred to in Cape Breton as the "black lagoon" and the terrible unaddressed health issues that have resulted from our community having in the midst of it the tar ponds. I guess we can't help but wonder if this province had had or had been able to do the health research necessary around this many years ago, would Cape Bretoners still be struggling with this whole issue. No one will dispute the fact that what we need in Cape Breton is some action around that issue, but certainly if we are going to be able to learn from any of the situations that have developed there, I would think that research going on as the activity to address the issue is carried out, certainly there is lots to be learned that could no doubt help other people.

With health research, improving the lives of Nova Scotians in the health issue, it also does other things, and that is it attracts highly-qualified and skilled professionals to our province, and that is something that we continually reach to achieve. We know that to have a research foundation such as this will definitely create the opportunity for people to come

[Page 4674]

here and to be involved in some of the many things, I mentioned the industrial area of Cape Breton and some of the environmental issues around that, but certainly the whole issue of environmental health is one that research could certainly help us to address.

I think that the research foundation, obviously, would attract professionals and qualified individuals who would bring with them the understanding and compassion that would be necessary and in the end, move forward the health of Nova Scotians.

The final comment I would make is that amidst all this, it certainly gives our young people in Nova Scotia a model, it gives us something to achieve and something to look forward to, something to be there for them so that those who would be interested in this type of science, this type of endeavour, would have the opportunity to hear and see lots about it. Mr. Speaker, it is with pleasure that I support this health research foundation and, hopefully, we will see some of the benefits of what can happen to improve the lives of Nova Scotians. Thank you.

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable member for Cape Breton Centre.

MR. FRANK CORBETT: Mr. Speaker, I too would like to rise today and speak about the bill, the Nova Scotia Health Research Foundation Act. I just wanted to say a few words about the industrial Cape Breton area and the horrendous problem that it finds itself in, insofar as what some people call the black lagoon - and, rightfully - the tar ponds and all these other subjects, and how this bill certainly impacts on it.

In Cape Breton, I don't think there is a piece of real estate that has been studied more, from the amount of pollutants to its economy, right down the line. That small piece of real estate, I don't think you could compare it to anywhere else in at least this hemisphere that has been studied as much as this. Just within the last four months we have had major studies done on the health implications of that area and there is no denying by the general public and, indeed, everybody in this House also, that cancer rates in industrial Cape Breton are just horrendous. It is not a large leap of faith to take and attribute it directly to industrial waste sites.

MR. SPEAKER: I think the honourable member is getting into debate on the tar ponds, rather than discussing the present bill that we have before us.

MR. CORBETT: I will cut off my circuitous route, Mr. Speaker. These areas need to be studied and this is what we are hoping this bill will do for us. Too many times we have found that with areas like this, the horse is out of the barn, if you will, before we find a solution. That is what I am hoping this bill will do. Bill No. 22 will be proactive in this. There was a time not too long ago in this country that people would argue that people were not really suffering any problems from coal dust in the mines, because there was no data to

[Page 4675]

substantiate that. People would move on and tell you that is probably just not so, there is no illness correlation, so we had to move on.

Today, we have a large and very active employer in the Strait area with Stora Forest Industries. Stora, Port Hawkesbury, is a very good employer, but you talk to some of those people and they will talk to you about diseases that could be in the air there. This is what I am hoping this bill will do. It will go in a way that will help research things on the shop floor and how these could be related to the workplace and diseases. That is the importance of this. It is important that this bill enable researchers to be proactive.

My colleague for Cape Breton The Lakes talked about the native population in this province. We know, at times, they encounter larger than average health problems, especially diabetes. We appreciate that problem and I think, again, that is one of these things that with Bill No. 22 being enacted would certainly help us.

We, by and large, support this bill and it is good. I realize it was part of the government's platform and they moved it forward. We see that there are many people suffering many diseases.

I will get back to my area in and around industrial Cape Breton and the large cancer rates. I don't think we have any argument there to the fact that it is much higher than the national average and we have our problems. One could say, well, what would this bill do? I think that had this bill been enacted some time much earlier there would be a recognition of that and that studies would have been done, quite possibly, that we would not have had this devastation in Cape Breton. Truly, it is clear that it is a devastation.

[4:15 p.m.]

There are all forms of support that is needed for health research in this province. We have just opened a new oncology department, a new building, as a matter of fact, in conjunction with Cape Breton Regional Hospital. We believe that that is an area where a great amount of this research could be done. It should be done on the Island. Basically, what I am saying is you have a large group of data already gathered, so you go and you take that information, Madam Speaker, and it is there for you. It is compiled.

As we know right now, in this province, we have a study on heart disease. Where is this going? This is being looked at and we are going from one end of this province to the other looking at it. Now it is funded partly by the province and partly by the private sector. Again, what are we doing with this? Are we really trying to identify, are we looking out to tell us, yes, there are problems with the health care system in this province as it goes to heart disease? I think that is a given, going at that. There is a problem with heart disease.

[Page 4676]

One has to wonder, what is the purpose of this panel that is studying heart disease and its effects on Nova Scotians? We must go and if we had in place, when that started, Bill No. 22, I think we would have a better structure. With that said, I think what they are doing now is a very good study. I think they are doing the best with what they have. It is a well-meaning group. Anytime that there is a step put forward to study the health care attitudes of Nova Scotians, it is positive. We very much support this.

Madam Speaker, I will be closing shortly and I just want to let the government know, in case they weren't listening, that while this bill, with the support of our side of the House, will probably move forward, that we want them to know that research has to be done for all of Nova Scotia. It has to be done for metro Halifax. It has to be done for Cape Breton, it has to be done for industrial Cape Breton, the Strait area, the Highlands. It has to be done for Antigonish. It has to be done for Yarmouth. We can't look at this province in isolation and do it on the peninsula of Halifax, if you will. We have to get out and tell the people in this province that we are doing research for them all. People in this province will let us know what they are.

Madam Speaker, I will be wrapping up in saying that I believe I will be supporting this bill. It is a bill that will, hopefully, help all Nova Scotians. (Interruptions) I should have done some research on crows because they are yelping fairly well back there.

AN HON. MEMBER: Crows don't yelp.

MR. CORBETT: Crows caw.

AN HON. MEMBER: Those from the Third Party can caw.

MR. CORBETT: No, they are a bird of a different feather and they flock together once in a while with their comrades across the way. Madam Speaker, I appreciate the time allotted to me today. I apologize if I strayed a bit, but it is something that I felt dearly about. In closing, I wish to thank you and the House for your time and your indulgence.

MR. SPEAKER: The motion is for third reading of Bill No. 22. Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

Ordered that this bill do pass. Ordered that the title be as read by the Clerk. Ordered that the bill be engrossed.

The honourable Government House Leader.

[Page 4677]

HON. MANNING MACDONALD: Mr. Speaker, I would have to receive the unanimous consent of the House to call Bill No. 83, the Motor Vehicle Act.

MR. JOHN HOLM: Mr. Speaker, that hasn't gone through the Committee of the Whole stage yet and, if my memory serves me correctly (Interruption)

Yes, but, Mr. Speaker, quite honestly, we are not quite ready to deal with that because we understand there were a lot of amendments made at the committee stage and we haven't had a chance to look at them or caucus them yet, so we would ask that you move to other bills. We are not prepared to give that permission at this time.

MR. SPEAKER: The honourable Government House Leader.

HON. MANNING MACDONALD: Mr. Speaker, I move that you do now leave the Chair and the House resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole House on Bills.

MR. SPEAKER: The motion is that the Speaker do now leave the Chair and the House resolve itself into a Committee of the Whole House on Bills. Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

The motion is carried.

[4:23 p.m. The House resolved itself into a CWH on Bills with Deputy Speaker Mr. Donald Chard in the Chair.]

[9:57 p.m. CWH on Bills rose and the House reconvened. Mr. Speaker, Hon. Ronald Russell, resumed the Chair.]

MR. SPEAKER: The Chairman of the Committee of the Whole House on Bills reports:

THE CLERK: That the committee has met and made progress and begs leave to sit again.

MR. SPEAKER: Is it agreed?

It is agreed.

The honourable Government House Leader.

[Page 4678]

HON. MANNING MACDONALD: Mr. Speaker, tomorrow the House will sit from the hours of 12:00 noon until 8:00 p.m. Following the daily routine and Question Period, we will continue with Committee of the Whole House on Bills and the order of calling will be decided tomorrow.

MR. SPEAKER: The motion is to adjourn. Would all those in favour of the motion please say Aye. Contrary minded, Nay.

The motion is carried.

We stand adjourned until 12:00 noon tomorrow.

[The House rose at 9:58 p.m.]